Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin

[Kamikaze]

I admit that my first reaction was to order a Garmin Fenix 5. That is because the key to me has always been the ability get the data from the watch. Aside from training, I use the HR data for other insights into my heart mechanics. I realize that is not your everyday use but there are numerous apps that suck in the Suunto data files and perform impressive analytics. KubiosHRV is one of them. That said, I use my old t6d, and Ambit most of the time simply because I can get the data files and they are ANT compatible with my HR chest strap. I do not use the A3 and hardly ever use the Ultra. So, let’s assess what actually is “lost” without MovesCount. From my use, the answer is “nothing” because I intercept the data when it is “at rest” on my computer. About all I use MC for is posting to social media. I do upload GPX files derived from my Suunto devices to Garmin_Connect for analysis. From a customer relations standpoint, I think it is a mistake on Suunto’s part to force all desktop/laptop users to using a smartphone app.

[witchcraft]

@Kamikaz Which is fine as long as MovesLink isn’t deprecated along with MovesCount. Much of the functionality of Strava is also blocked (challenges and competitions) on manual uploaded .gpx files

[tcdev]

@witchcraft Is it though? Where is MovesLink going to upload to then? My understanding is that data is uploaded to MC then from there pushed to other services like Strava.

[jthomi]

Thats correct.

@tcdev said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

@witchcraft Is it though? Where is MovesLink going to upload to then? My understanding is that data is uploaded to MC then from there pushed to other services like Strava.

[Lachesnaye]

Bonjour si plus de site Web, au revoir suunto et bonjour, Garmin ou polar ou tous ceux qui proposent un site Web

[radlwadl]

@Brad_Olwin So I try to be as constructive as you are.
I joined this forum a few minutes ago, because I wanted to get a picture about the discussion and reaction of your customers. My first reaction was the same as the OP’s one: Throw away my Ambit2 checking market for other brand’s watches.

My first uploaded Ambit2’s move dates to 21th Dec. 2014. Four years ago I decided to buy the Ambit 2 Peak rather than the 3 because it was cheaper and I had no need to link it via bluetooth. It still works fine and meanwhile we’ve got three Ambit2s in our family.

So, being constructive, I summarize the facts about Ambit2/3 I see here in the forum:
Ambit3 isn’t supported 100%.
Ambit2: Currents status is, that it won’t be supported by the app.
My thoughts about Ambit2: It’s impossible to link Ambit2 with mobiles due to missing bluetooth. So Suunto would have to build a cable for connecting the watch with the mobile. Then Suunto still has to struggle with building these cables - all this mechanical stuff you don’t want to deal with.

It’s said, there is still plenty of time - 1,5 years. In agile software development this is in fact a lot of time and it should be sufficient to get the Ambit 3 fully supported - keep fingers crossed.
But concerning Ambit2 and all other older watches I think “Alea iacta est” - decisions are made, because it’s fundamental: Suunto strategy is to support bluetooth link only.

Even you expect, or better you “think” that there will be 3rd party solutions for those.

You wanted the OP to be more constructive and answered in a more or less constructive way. And so I’ll do.
I understand, that Suunto want to focus on building watches. It’s not your main business to build software for analyzing training data. It’s expensive and companies like STRAVA do this better than you do.
Ok, but having a 5,5 years old watch being more or less useless, is expensive for me, too.

Please give a detailed strategy for Ambit2. In case Suunto hopes for 3rd party solutions or those are even planned, 1,5 years aren’t much time to coordinate this with your partners.
My opinion to 3rd party solution: I don’t want to pay for it. Why, pay for a e.g. trainingpeaks licence just to download Ambit2 data, when I once bought a watch which included this functionality?
There might be some opensource solution - but who takes care for maintenance?

Discount for purchasing a new watch: Hmmm, last summer one of my three avalanche beacons had an not fixable error. It was ten years old, the same model is still sold. I got a new one from the manufacture paying less than the cheapest price in the web. That was more than ok. That’s what I expect at least for a discount. But it should be more. Because it’s Suunto’s active decision to make Ambit2 useless.

“Suunto does not want to lose customers” - but, to be honest, Suunto is on the best way to do so. I’m happy with my Ambit2. I’m happy with its reliability and usability. I’m happy with it working for four years now, especially in matter of sustainability. I don’t want to buy a new gadget every few years, because it costs money, it costs resources and I don’t need the newest fancy thing. I need a working device, that’s all.
I was happy with Suunto’s service after we realized the the brand new watch was buggy. It was repaired within a few days - perfect.

But I’m not happy with Suunto’s digital service strategy.

Based on Suunto’s decision I’ll decide. And this may end in saying goodbye to Suunto. It’s up to Suunto to convince me. All I’ve read right now, does not.

[Mathieu Georges]

@radlwadl said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

But concerning Ambit2 and all other older watches I think “Alea iacta est” - decisions are made, because it’s fundamental: Suunto strategy is to support bluetooth link only.

I think the the Suunto strategy is to reduce the development and maintenance of software that is not making money.
The owner of Suunto, Amer Sports is also the owner of Sport Tracker. So they are just doing the minimum : an App. Then, they will force allow you to use other third parties application such as Sport Tracker. They just forget something, the freedom of the users they provided earlier. They are reducing it by providing less features than before.

Also, as an embedded software developper and a user of an Ambit3 Peak, the use of both Bluetooth and USB link should be kept. In fact, Bluetooth is a wireless technology that have it pros and cons but I can say that it’s really helpful to have a cable link to avoid a stucking issue. I already had this kind of issue while syncing a move between my mobile and my Ambit3. The only way to get the move was to use the USB cable and moveslink. So, Suunto, be aware of what you are doing, even if you think your tests cover every use cases.

My expectations of Suunto company were rather the improvements of the mobile app and the web application to provide better experience for the users. I think that Suunto have the best hardware but is missing the turn of software application (web based and mobile). This kind of feature can attract new users and keep the old ones.

Hope this will be heard by Suunto

[ESegerer]

@Navigator said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

Cant believe what I just read in the email from Suunto are they MAD !!!
I’ve an Ambit and Ambit 3 Peak and consider them the best ‘adventure’ watches made and always recommended them to anyone that asks for my advice.
So now from next year in the eyes of Suunto the Ambit can be considered a piece of junk as wont be able to upload or download to it and with the Peak am expected to fiddle on some mobile device to hopefully upload routes and download tracks where now I can do it on my 17" laptop and charge at the same time.
So very very disappointing.
I certainly wont be buying anything branded Suunto in the future. Garmin here I come

Thanks for this post. I had the same feelings and sent an email to support (which has not been answered yet).

Why am I disappointed?
I bought a new Ambit 3 Peak (with heart belt) in Feb 2018 after comparing it with Garmin products. I considered Suunto a good brand building lasting products. And yes I prefer having a large screen when looking at my tracks (running, mountaineering, skiing).
@Brad_Olwin stated that the Ambits are outdated in 1.5 years. Hopefully this is not the official opinion of Suunto. Otherwise I would be even more disappointed. I expect to use the Ambit at least 10 years.

[estevez]

@ESegerer
I have already posted it in another topic - info from Suunto Support (09/2018):
“(…) we assure you that Ambit3 peak will be supported maybe longer than new Suunto watch models since these models are already proven to be reliable and has been one of the best selling watch models from Suunto, just like Suunto Core. There are no plans in changing apps and websites for Ambit family. If there will be significant changes, it could be switching from using Moveslink2 to Suuntolink (which is still being discussed not yet planned) which does not really have any significant effect on the watch.”

So I ordered my 2nd Ambit3 Peak… And few days ago I received mail that Movescount will be substituted with mobile app - which will cause, that my Ambit 3 Peak watches (2 pieces) will be significantly less functional. I need customization, sportsmodes, suunto user apps, route planning + uplod, POIs, etc. And I need it in user friendly form, i.e. web od PC. Movescount was for me a significant reason why I choosed Suunto.

[Brad_Olwin]

@ESegerer said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

@Navigator said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

Cant believe what I just read in the email from Suunto are they MAD !!!
I’ve an Ambit and Ambit 3 Peak and consider them the best ‘adventure’ watches made and always recommended them to anyone that asks for my advice.
So now from next year in the eyes of Suunto the Ambit can be considered a piece of junk as wont be able to upload or download to it and with the Peak am expected to fiddle on some mobile device to hopefully upload routes and download tracks where now I can do it on my 17" laptop and charge at the same time.
So very very disappointing.
I certainly wont be buying anything branded Suunto in the future. Garmin here I come

Thanks for this post. I had the same feelings and sent an email to support (which has not been answered yet).

Why am I disappointed?
I bought a new Ambit 3 Peak (with heart belt) in Feb 2018 after comparing it with Garmin products. I considered Suunto a good brand building lasting products. And yes I prefer having a large screen when looking at my tracks (running, mountaineering, skiing).
@Brad_Olwin stated that the Ambits are outdated in 1.5 years. Hopefully this is not the official opinion of Suunto. Otherwise I would be even more disappointed. I expect to use the Ambit at least 10 years.

I did not say that, please don’t misquote me. The BLE connected watches will be supported and do work with SA. The features are just getting implemented.

[A Former User]

This comment on DCRainmaker sums it all for me:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2019/01/suunto-announces-decommission-plans-for-movescount-platform-impacting-some-watches.html#comment-3061899

For a while we all supported Suunto because they are more stable than Garmin, even if with less features (from ambit 2 onwards). I think newer models are “as bad” as garmins are, so if suunto tells me to drop a 500eur watch to the bin, guess I will choose something else. Garmin may not be the best, but at least you can take out their data and change sports modes on the watch.
Quoting from DCrainmaker "Of course, the biggest issue here is how to handle the Ambit 1/2 units. One of the most overlooked aspects of the Garmin device world is the non-reliance for virtually all of their devices on a web-based service to access your recorded workouts. You can simply plug in your watch to your computer and offload it via USB like any other file or with local desktop software that exports to your computer (even a Garmin Forerunner 305 from 13 years ago!) . "
Hope suunto gets their identity and their focus sorted. For me this is the Nokia story repeated, they had good keypad feature phones, business models, ok the trend was touch, they simply didn’t do it right, and that is what is happening with suunto, even with some models less sophisticated, if they were stable we would buy it. When my ambit 2 sapphire dies I would buy a ambit 3 sapphire new if it was supported at 100%.
Those “techology moves fast” guys…just tell me what newer suunto watches have that Ambit 3 don’t? If you talk about fenix 5x yes…it has, but newer suuntos guess not.
Again, better suunto think again and see where they were and where they want to move. I think they are thinking that “apple watches” alike will be a mine of gold, but with the quality of suunto apps I guess it will fail in a hurry.
Hope I am wrong and that this all this shift turns the brand into something even better “Suunto…replacing luck”.
In the meanwhile I also bought a Garmin, but an etrex 30x. It will take me a while to switch to a Fenix…but…if things go on this way, it would be the only route I believe…or an amazfit stratos (considering it is 1/5th of the price).

[whychange]

@Navigator - it seems to be a VERY common reaction (including that of my wife’s and mine). I believe they’re sinking the ship on purpose.

[vintagemilano]

After being bombarded by Suunto about these plans to dump Movescount and go to Suuntoapp, I’ve been reading as much as I can about how this is going to affect me. I have an Ambit3 Peak. The consistent message I’ve come across several times in various forms is, “Suunto doesn’t have a hardware problem, they have a software problem.” True to a point I guess. I didn’t have a problem with MC, none, zilch. Did everything I wanted it to do. Including movies which I could save and then text to friends that were along for the adventure.
I have not been able to get even half my data from my watch to SA, I have so much time into trying to get that to work, that if I was getting paid for it I could buy a brand new watch. Something cool, like a Breitling or TAG. A watch, something that tells time and lasts forever.

Cheers, C

[radlwadl]

@André-Faria said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

Quoting from DCrainmaker "Of course, the biggest issue here is how to handle the Ambit 1/2 units. One of the most overlooked aspects of the Garmin device world is the non-reliance for virtually all of their devices on a web-based service to access your recorded workouts. You can simply plug in your watch to your computer and offload it via USB like any other file or with local desktop software that exports to your computer (even a Garmin Forerunner 305 from 13 years ago!) . "

Thanks for quoting this comment. It sums it for me, too.
Four years ago I searched a sports watch, looked into the different brands and opted for a Suunto Ambit 2 Peak. Meanwhile we’ve three of them in my family. Working all day on the laptop there was no need for the BT connectivity. I use all my gear as long as possible, treat it well and I’m willing to pay for quality, and to buy new gear, if the old one is done. Now its battery lost a little of capacity - ok, that’s battery life. I expected to buy a new Suunto as soon as the A2 wasn’t able to cover my long tours, maybe in one or two years.
But now I’m in the situation I was four years ago: Looking into the different brands, checking pros and cons, discussing with Fenix users. I know, that I will be able to migrate my data into SA, and with buying a new Suunto in 1,5y everything would be fine. But then everything once more depends on Suunto - what, if they change teir roadmap again?
To be independet from such decisions becomes more and more important for me.
Suunto - please here the callings

[Danny Hill]

Does anyone know Suunto have said regarding the Ambit 1? I like Suunto and keen to stick with them but if my watch is going to be unworkable I may have to look elsewhere too. Do Suunto have a part-exchange program (i.e. can we exchange our old watches for a new model)?

[freeheeler]

@Danny-Hill
there will be news about that next week i think.

I like Suunto a lot and would not change head over heels.

[Danny Hill]

@TELE-HO Thanks. Where do these types of announcements get published? on this forum?

[freeheeler]

@Danny-Hill
yes there are update threads but suunto also has a newsletter that i actually did not receive yet…

[lohtse]

@Brad_Olwin said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

@ESegerer said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

@Navigator said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

Cant believe what I just read in the email from Suunto are they MAD !!!
I’ve an Ambit and Ambit 3 Peak and consider them the best ‘adventure’ watches made and always recommended them to anyone that asks for my advice.
So now from next year in the eyes of Suunto the Ambit can be considered a piece of junk as wont be able to upload or download to it and with the Peak am expected to fiddle on some mobile device to hopefully upload routes and download tracks where now I can do it on my 17" laptop and charge at the same time.
So very very disappointing.
I certainly wont be buying anything branded Suunto in the future. Garmin here I come

Thanks for this post. I had the same feelings and sent an email to support (which has not been answered yet).

Why am I disappointed?
I bought a new Ambit 3 Peak (with heart belt) in Feb 2018 after comparing it with Garmin products. I considered Suunto a good brand building lasting products. And yes I prefer having a large screen when looking at my tracks (running, mountaineering, skiing).
@Brad_Olwin stated that the Ambits are outdated in 1.5 years. Hopefully this is not the official opinion of Suunto. Otherwise I would be even more disappointed. I expect to use the Ambit at least 10 years.

I did not say that, please don’t misquote me. The BLE connected watches will be supported and do work with SA. The features are just getting implemented.

THe Ambit 3 and traverse range BARELY work!!!

[lohtse]

@Brad_Olwin said in Goodbye Suunto, hello Garmin:

@Navigator The Ambit 3 is supported, albeit not for apps. Rather than complain loudly and bitterly here or buy a newer watch as seriously Ambits in another 1.5 years will be fairly out of date…go to another manufacturer but please quit wasting our time. Some of us here like our hardware and want to see the mobile app improve…bye…

If we don’t voice our concerns then Manufactures will simply drop/discontinue devices at a whim… When you have spent £300-500 on a device that runs circles round everything else out there you have a right in my opinion to complain LOUDLY… It is not wasting time at all… As to the ambit 3 support…it is only just supported…you can look at your data and create/upload a route…But thats all now compare it to movescount… Errrrrrrrrrrm you can do so much more… I for one with my ambit 3 peak want FULL functionality not 30%… And I am on the side of ALL ambit users…We all should get full functionality…