is a system update coming ?

olymay

@cristian-0 but the S7 does auto-laps and has a running interval mode. Granted, they aren’t super advanced or over customisable, but they are there. And still better than most alternatives.

Remember, this is a smartwatch first and a fitness watch second. The fact that it has as much of the Suunto App on it at all is pretty incredible.

Would I want a WearOS device with S9P features and battery? Hell yes!
Is it physically possible? I don’t think so.
Would it be astronomically expensive it it were possible? Most definitely.

I do understand where you are coming from with the features you want and why you want them. Sadly, as with most things in life, there is no perfect device out there and there will always be a compromise.
Lets not forget this is the first WearOS device Suunto have made. They are likely taking on board all feedback and looking at how to implement as much as possible into the next generation device. Whilst also working their buts off to keep the current model supported.

I don’t work for Suunto, or know anyone who does. Nor do I have any affiliation with them. I don’t have any loyalty to them. In fact, I have never used a Suunto device until 18 months ago. BUT, I have used many, many, many electronic devices (smart or otherwise) over the past 30 years and so far I am seriously impressed with the work that Suunto have done and the support they provide. Are they perfect? No. Are they doing their best to give the customer what they want? I believe so.

Which is why I think the S7 is not done yet, I believe there are more updates to come. And I really hope there will be a second gen (Suunto 7 Peak anyone??) which will truly knock it out of the park.

sartoric

giulio

@dimitrios-kanellopoulos
So…no more update (improvements,bug fixes)?

Egika

@giulio what makes you think so?

giulio

@egika
I think that after 5 mont all we wait un update about improvements,feature added and this is a security update so sound like end development suunto 7…

Jamie BG

Commet deleted as I read further down the thread…

Jamie BG

@olymay @cristian-0
Take a look at the Garmin Fenix 6xPro - comes very close to being “perfect” but it has it flaws - a touch screen included on it would be awesome for map work and general navigation. Better app store.
MIssing activity types that should be easy for Garmin to add like HIIT (so you can’t even add a HIIT workout - have to create a cardio activity call it HIIT and then recreate a HIIT workout as a cardio workout) etc etc.
Look close enough at anything and you can find loads of flaws and issues; and stuff that may be a flaw for someone can be a bonus or non entity for someone else.
rather focus on the silver linings the good stuff…

olymay

@jamie-bg said in is a system update coming ?:

@olymay @cristian-0
Take a look at the Garmin Fenix 6xPro - comes very close to being “perfect” but it has it flaws

Problem is, what is ‘perfect’ for one person could be useless for another.
For example, I want my watch to have WearOS. I want it to be a smartwatch first because most of the time I am wearing it I am not running over hills. BUT, I also want it to be capable for when I am running over hills. And I do not want to be swapping devices, especially if that means different manufactures and locations for my data.
This is the 21st century and I should be able to use a single device for my needs and have a central location for my data. The Suunto 7 is ‘close to perfect’ for me.
(I do love Garmin for the most part, but there are some aspects of them that drive me round the bend!)

a touch screen included on it would be awesome for map work and general navigation. Better app store.
MIssing activity types that should be easy for Garmin to add like HIIT (so you can’t even add a HIIT workout - have to create a cardio activity call it HIIT and then recreate a HIIT workout as a cardio workout) etc etc.
Look close enough at anything and you can find loads of flaws and issues; and stuff that may be a flaw for someone can be a bonus or non entity for someone else.
rather focus on the silver linings the good stuff…

Your final statement is bang on. We are all different and should look at what each device offers and decide if it fits for our needs. We should weigh up the pros and cons of each device and accept any limitations that may come with our decision. It is not ‘unfair’ if a manufacturer doesn’t design and make a product specifically to me, it is life.
As you say, I focus on the good bits of my S7 (of which there are MANY) and will continue to enjoy it (and enjoy the second generation when it
hopefully comes out )

Cristian 0

@jamie-bg probably I am a little bit annoy because my expectations were too high around next update and it didn’t include any new feature.

I was thinking about buying a Garmin 5X plus but I was delaying it because I like my suunto 7 even with its weaknesses but I am using it regularly to do custom work outs like 10x400m , 2000+1000+2000 and is painful to have to check the watch a few times to do the session using the manual lap.

But even doing the trainings using the manual lap it works ok because we have 2 additional buttons to do it easier.

I know that is difficult to implement any new feature… but I am still thinking that a custom auto lap and a very simple interval session could have been implemented and then it could be more than a smartwatch and nearly a real sport watch. Because it is one of the basic features of any sport watch.

the battery life never was a big deal… just good way to get my wrist tan.

I don’t have the source code … but when the app is as good as it is , include new features wouldn’t be very very difficult because the hard job was done. I could think they are already thinking about a new suunto 7 version and It will come with the new one.

I am a dreamer and this was just another dream more hehe

olymay

@cristian-0 That’s a much happier and more positive post And pretty much very similar to how I feel

I think the S7 is a superb watch, but yes, it is not perfect.

I do agree that custom auto laps, or the ability to program complex intervals, would be an amazing addition. I won’t try to second guess Suunto as to why they haven’t included it. But like you I will ask them to include it in either an update or a next gen S7

I think you have fallen into the same trap as me, in that we have become accustomed to Suunto releasing big updates for the S7 with juicy added features, and anything less than that feels disappointing. Suunto has become a victim of their own success

Anyway, glad to hear you do still love the S7. And do keep sending the feature requests and ideas to Suunto, the more they hear from us customers the more chance they will listen

Nigel Taylor 0

@olymay said in is a system update coming ?:

Would I want a WearOS device with S9P features and battery? Hell yes!
Is it physically possible? I don’t think so.

Its an interesting thought. Do WearOS watches have to have an AMOLED screen?

How long would a TFT based WearOS device last on a full charge.?

Am assuming that WearOS (because of the versatility) is not as efficient as a finally tuned more closed platform - but I would pay handsomely (£500GBP or 10,000 acorns) for a WearOS Suunto watch with a TFT screen that lasted a week between charges that I could be confident of covering 18hrs worth of GPS activity with from 100% (times that are roughly half the battery life I get from my TFT based non WearOS running watches, compared to 2 days standby & about 8hrs (if I’m careful) GPS activity tracking I get from S7) - that had GooglePay support and everything else you get with WearOS.

Amoled screens are good. But they’re definitely a compromise I’d drop in place of more battery life…even if I don’t need that battery life, just the extra confidence you get from having a watch with better life adds value…as my marathon program has ramped up, I’ve been away from S7 and back to my ‘other’ watches…seeing it now at 85% on a Friday (having last recharged I think on Monday morning or Sunday evening), and knowing I can run 12k tonight, a parkrun tomorrow, 30k on Sunday and not even have to think about recharging until Monday morning (and probably end of next week if I wanted to stretch it out) is a different prospect entirely in terms of ‘wrist confidence’.

olymay

@nigel-taylor-0

Do WearOS ‘have’ to have OLED screens? Definitely not. But, with everything that WearOS can do it is definitely a very nice to have. The high resolution, high contrast, and excellent colours do make it almost essential.

I’m assuming by TFT you mean the transflective screens used by other Suunto watches and Garmin etc? If so, then there isn’t actually that much battery to be saved.
Most of the time these screens are used primarily to be visible in bright sunshine. Which is very nice, but has a cost of low resolution, low contrast, poor colours, and generally looking a bit naff.

OLED (rather than LCD) only powers the pixels that need it, so depending on what is being displayed then the power consumption can vary wildly. This is another reason that AoD isn’t always the best option with OLED (a small sacrifice).

The biggest power drain with WearOS devices is not the screen, it is the operating system and antiquated SoC.
A WearOS device is doing hundreds of things more in the background than a Suunto 9 or a Garmin F6. That is what is eating the battery.
This is the trade off of a smartwatch vs a sportswatch.

If you want to see how long the S7 can last without WearOS eating all of the battery, pop it into battery saver mode. It is still using the exact same screen (although it is likely now powering more pixels than the ambient screen). The watch will last for days and days and days. (although you won’t be able to do much with it!).

Don’t get me wrong, I would LOVE LOVE LOVE a Suunto 7 that lasted as long as a Suunto 9 Peak with the same fitness smarts inside, still an OLED, NFC for GPay, all the other smartwatch features, etc. I wouldn’t care if it cost me £700 (aslong as it was supported for a MINIMUM of three years at that price!).

Sadly, I don’t think it is physically possible right now

Jamie BG

@Nigel-Taylor-0 > the ticwatch E3 has a LCD screen, but doesn’t seem to help overally much in battery life, so may be some point to what @olymay says. But if that is the case then why is the Garmin V2 (with an AMOLED screen like S7/GW4) only 2/3 days battery life like them, but with 11 days with screen off, and Garmin VA4 which is almost same as V2 but different screen has up to 6 days. To me this screams that the screen is the major impact factor, and really not what is going on in the background.

Lets face it, phones are pretty much the same - screen on always doing something - normally get around 5-6hrs of always on screen life. with it off, and its a different ball game +24hrs.

olymay

@jamie-bg it’s probably a better to compare the Garmin Venu (1st gen) to the VA4, as they are the same watch with the screen being the main differentiator.

The official figures for the Venu are
5 days in smartwatch mode (no gps) with screen off.
3 days in smartwatch mode (no gps) with screen always on.
6hrs of gps
(my lass has a Venu and these figures are pretty accurate)

the VA4 is
8 days in smartwatch mode (no gps)
6hrs of gps

The screen clearly does have an impact, but not as much as we would think.

If I use my own S7 for comparison, using it with screen always on, vs raise to wake (with power saver tilt) is a negligable difference.

I think the big difference comes when using the watch in full power mode it causes the SoC to fire up which in turn drinks the battery.

Jamie BG

@olymay - Still think its the screen. Can’t see how it can’t be if a watch goes from 2 days with AOD on to 5/11 days with it off. Anything going on in the background will still be going on. That will not change.
Just like a phone - keep you screen on you get 5/6 hours - allow the screen to time out you get around 24 hrs.

The watches without AMOLED/LCD screen have same if not more processing going on in the background (Fenix etc), yet still have longer screen time/overall battery life.

olymay

@jamie-bg we are running the risk of splitting hairs here

we keep comparing the battery life of AMOLED screens with the display always on or off. It’s a shame we can’t do the same with the transflective screens. I know it would be less of a hit, but it would still be interesting to see.

An AMOLED is always going to use more power than a transflective screen. But as the AMOLED is lit, would it be as much of a gulf if the transflective were also permanently lit?

I also think part of it is due to the AMOLED screen having more colours and higher resolution needing more processing power to operate.

However, one final comparison if I may…

A Suunto 7 with AoD off, tilt to wake off, etc. essentially in smartwatch mode but with as many power saving options on as possible. Should get you an easy 2 days, but not much more.

A Garmin VA4 will get 7-8 days.

WearOS is a power hungry OS and the current generation SD SoC is not power efficient.
I am homing that both of these factors change in the near future, as well as better battery tech over the next few years.
I think seeing a proper smartwatch with 5+ days of battery life is not unrealistic (although, I thought the same about smartphones a few years back )

aeroild

@olymay said in is a system update coming ?:

Suunto do listen and they do respond. For example, the issue of external sensors was explained by not wanting to affect battery life. Which judging the impact of using Bluetooth headphones with the watch, is a serious hit.
Yes, I would like to have the option. But Suunto have made their decision and explained it.

In that respect, it’s a bit ironic that Suunto is promoting doing activities like running while listening to Spotify with offline music on the Suunto 7.

Jamie BG

@olymay
A Garmin VA4 will get 7-8 days (generous probably 4-6 more realstic based on what I have seen and been told).
Venu 2 will get 2-3 days with AOD on.
They are running virtually the same software. So surely if a AMOLED doesn’t draw that much power, with same software, same battery size - surely the Venu 2 should get per the VA4 7-8 (4-6) days?

It doesn’t so what is the main differnce - the screens!

I don’t deny that wear os is power hungry, and that is why we don’t see the same AOD off times i.e. GW4/Suunto 7 etc i.e. 2/3 days AOD on and up to 3/4 with it off i.e. not much difference. Yet the V2 difference is startling - 2/3 days goes up to 11 days with AOD off. So based on that yes I would agree with you that wear os is way more power hungry than garmin.

But again this just further reinforces my thoery on the screens being the major power drain. Especially as I know of no AMOLED wrist wearable that goes beyond 3 days. Fitbit can get past it, but only with AOD off, and can do up 6 days with AOD off.

olymay

@jamie-bg i think this is all relative.

With Garmin, the chipset and OS barely use any power (as they are doing very little in the background). Therefore, changing from an unlit low resolution transflective screen to a lit high resolution AMOLED screen will be a significant change.

However, on WearOS, the chipset is way more powerful and doing significantly more in the background (as well as being inefficient!), that changing screen type (or even how it is used) has a comparatively small affect on the battery consumption.

any info on what is contained in today’s update?