Something new is coming

Theo Lakerveld

Dimitrios, I understand that. Living in Norway and working in heavy industry I’m very aware of practical limitations. I’m also aware of all the online tools (teams, zoom, online databases etc etc) that are available that make it posible to drive development from the home office. With a good preventive attitude and routines, production facilities can be and are kept operative throughout the pandemic in Europe. There are countless examples of that in a multitude of industries.
Suunto still has a solid brand name that, according to my opinion, needs to be backed up by device quality and customer service (which it does), usefull inovation (devices are currently laging behind, while the app is defenitly is going in the right direction) and a certain degree of predictability (e.g. issueing new devices according to a regular intervall).
According to my personal opinion, Suunto is lagging behind. The owners/shareholders should protect their investment to maintain and increase their market share by investing is whizzkids and developers to keep up with the competition.

Theo Lakerveld

@sartoric , Garmin has this solar charging thingy, coros has an integrated (and dependable?) running power meter, etc etc. Of course we don’t “need” a new device. But without gradual inovation, humanity would still be living in a cave and hunt a days supply of food to survive. The whole global society is funded by growth and fedd by innovation.

Saketo Nemo

@Theo-Lakerveld

Forgive me if I laugh, but normally people here complain that "new watches are always coming out, while they should think about improving their software ! "

The new software does not bring suunto new money, except in the long run, retaining the current owners of suunto 9, suunto 5 and suunto 7, so I guess there will also be time for a new device.

Personally, I appreciate the fact that they don’t launch a top of the range every year and instead focus on improving what they already have at home.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Theo-Lakerveld COROS doen’t have an power meter (inside the watch), its all software that does this. I think there is even a garmin app for garmins in this respect.

While you said it correctly, development can continue via various tools that applies only to software. Hardware development is hard, imagine having to bring at home to each worker all the boards to test eg a new chip driver. Possible but applies limitations.

What point you missed I think here, is that while development can continue normally (remotely) if the factory cannot produce in a rate that is sufficient for paying the SW devs then you cannot scale the devs.

I hope it makes sense .

nseslija

@Saketo-Nemo Exactly

Rob33

@Saketo-Nemo ,i am ok. wait to see for the S9.

But I’m not sure I understand correctly, it’s true that so much communication for just a new baro feature would be a disappointment … I’m one of the people who consult the weather before leaving, especially in the mountains. and in the event of an unforeseen phenomenon, if I am far away, an alert does not help me much …
But everyone is different.

Saketo Nemo

@Rob33
I’m not a commercial and I don’t do marketing, but I think it would be stupid of them to release teasers detailing every feature of the update. It would take away the hype.
So, but it’s just a personal opinion, I don’t think the new update is based only on new baro features

Likarnik

@Saketo-Nemo I hope you are right

sartoric

@Rob33
Regarding this over-exposure, It’s just a matter of a disclaimer in the app … I don’t think this has reached that many people. I, as a spartaneer, didn’t get it.

But people want new features, this forum is full of “feature suggestions”

That said, I guess most of the people that “complain” about the usability/need of this function, look the feature from a trail runner or 1day hiker point of view.
If you do multiple days hike this can be helpful, for sure not crucial, to have an overview about possible weather condition.
I always check the weather forecast the day before, and even before leaving home for a 1 day trip, but if we are talking about a 5 days on an alpine ridge trail, you know that forecast for that long period are not really reliable, so this “stuff” can be helpful (or better that nothing) not to mention the jumpiness of mountain weather.

That said, watchface or activity screen is not the update itself, it’s just one of the “visible” feature

AdamMada

@chrish I join the topic

Theo Lakerveld

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos you’re right about the power ouput being a calculated metric, and not a measured value. Neither is a Stryd metric. Though, such innovation is what’s getting the crowd interested and drives sales and turnover. Especially when it’s introduced in a nearly identical device, with a fresh look and a slightly revised name such as Suunto 9.1. We don’t need a new device, but the larger crowd wants it.

I suspect that you’re indirectly indicating that a new product has been developed but that, due to these practical production limitations, Suunto isn’t able to release it yet. Instead, we get a teaser in the shape of a (minor) FW update. You don’t need to answer that, being restricted by a nice NDA. Either way, pro-active management should be able to accomodate for such challenges to protect the cash flow in the end.

Please don’t read my comments as negative, but rather as constructive. I’m aware that I’m not discussing with Suunto managment and ownership here. I like the Suunto brand, I would love to see it surviving, even though competition is tough (ref. Apple, Coros, Garmin, etc.) and that they are still leaping ahead of Suunto.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Theo-Lakerveld I dont see it as negative. Dont worry I just try to explain that sometimes things like this are not easy to manage.

Re: power

There are already many algos out there able to give you power. Typically those can be used even in realtime for bikes , since long now.

The thing that COROS did well for example is that they matched stryd 1:1 for non trails. That benefits the user.

Polar did a good job as well, perhaps better than COROS on the trails but it doesn’t match stryd. So You will have problems if you use stryd once and another time polar power. Just an example.

Theo Lakerveld

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos Yes, Coros was smart, complying their algorythms with the gold standard (Stryd). Most cycling power meters were doing the same in the beginning with SRM.
Either way, that’s focussing on details that could make a functionality a success or a failure. I hope that Suunto actively uses this forum to get feedback about feature suggestions and drive innovation.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Theo-Lakerveld said in Something new is coming:

I hope that Suunto actively uses this forum to get feedback about feature suggestions and drive innovation.

They do, but “typically” you do not you see a lot of innovative suggestions here. Not wanting to offend anyone, but typically we all speak about what we have seen from other brands etc.

But there are many people here that have given good suggestions and indeed innovative things. IF such a star happens believe me I personally try todo my best to reach more than one time the ears it should reach.

Fenr1r

If that first Time/Baro face is closed, locked down, sent off to college and wedded to the designers, disregard the following:

Pretty much everyone here seems to agree that a baro trend is of more use than a point value in determining imminent weather. (Hence the 2nd face [“ETA” - possibly limited to sports modes?]) And what else is a single raw baro value for? Needs conversion to give alt, for instance, and that’s already available in what I’m assuming is the central tap-to-change field.

But perhaps the lower/inner dial could do more with that baro scale to provide useful at-a-glance info? (Perhaps it does already.)

Change color according to recently rising, falling or static pressure. OR
Alter the bright sector to cover the past rather than evenly bracket the present. And/OR
Put a Pot of Trend (the simple 2-stage icon dating back at least to the Vector) at one end of the rainbow. Maybe instead of, or to balance the sunset icon*.

*Seriously, what IS that doing there? Does it represent a set sunset alarm? Is it to remind the user that the outer dial is turning anticlockwise?

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Fenr1r said in Something new is coming:

If that first Time/Baro face is closed, locked down, sent off to college and wedded to the designers, disregard the following:

Pretty much everyone here seems to agree that a baro trend is of more use than a point value in determining imminent weather. (Hence the 2nd face [“ETA” - possibly limited to sports modes?]) And what else is a single raw baro value for? Needs conversion to give alt, for instance, and that’s already available in what I’m assuming is the central tap-to-change field.

But perhaps the lower/inner dial could do more with that baro scale to provide useful at-a-glance info? (Perhaps it does already.)

Change color according to recently rising, falling or static pressure. OR

Alter the bright sector to cover the past rather than evenly bracket the present. And/OR

Put a Pot of Trend (the simple 2-stage icon dating back at least to the Vector) at one end of the rainbow. Maybe instead of, or to balance the sunset icon*.

*Seriously, what IS that doing there? Does it represent a set sunset alarm? Is it to remind the user that the outer dial is turning anticlockwise?

I think you will be more than pleased. Technically I am happy to inform you so.

Fenr1r

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos Since I have a Spartan, I reckon I’ll just be extra bitter. Consider my baro currently falling. But thank you for the thought!

Efejota

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos I guess that most of us use previous experiences to find out what is lacking. For instance, something that I always miss in the POI screen in the Ambit is the absence of a relative altitude reference (not only distance). I always thought that that data could easily be offered by the watch, but I might be wrong.

Being imaginative in abstract terms is another story. It would be good to know what kind of “stars” you have found (let’s say, really imaginative inputs).

Brad_Olwin

@moe67er said in Something new is coming:

@Brad_Olwin and those warnings are already implmented as I stated above in storm warnings, isn‘t it? This feature is nice. It raises an alarm and you can react. But on a trailrun or skimountaineering day I never check barometric values while I am out. I do it before… also for 3 day trips. And when I know there could be a bad weather it is ok.
And as said: storm warnings for e.g. fast incoming summer thunder storms are great and this feature should be implemented by all watches having a barometer. but I do not need the values of the barometric pressure itself.

The storm warning requires a rapid pressure drop. In my experience for weather where I am, it is often insufficient for fast thunderstorms. I am not checking the values but having the graph has allowed me to make decisions about whether to summit a peak or not out on a trail run. I have been testing this feature for awhile.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Efejota yes as well. Lacking I forgot to mention but I think that is implied.

POI Screen or waypoint ?