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    Hiking with battery mode Ultra

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    • Fenr1rF Offline
      Fenr1r @surfboomerang
      last edited by

      @surfboomerang Does the App allow you to create a sport mode with ETA/ETE fields AND GPS mode set to anything but Best?

      surfboomerangS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • surfboomerangS Offline
        surfboomerang @Fenr1r
        last edited by

        @fenr1r You don’t define GPS mode in the app. It happens in the watch.
        You can add ETE/ETA fields without a warning. When you select the sport mode and adjust GPS mode to OK in the watch, it also gives no warning.

        Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
        OnePlus Nord 4

        Fenr1rF 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
        • Fenr1rF Offline
          Fenr1r @surfboomerang
          last edited by

          @surfboomerang said in Hiking with battery mode Ultra:

          You can add ETE/ETA fields without a warning. When you select the sport mode and adjust GPS mode to OK in the watch, it also gives no warning.

          And that neatly answers what would have been my follow-up. Thanks.

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          • zadowZ Offline
            zadow @surfboomerang
            last edited by zadow

            @surfboomerang Hm, now I am not 100% sure, but if I remember it correctly, watch switch to BEST GPS every time, when ETA/ETE/destination field is in ACTIVE (current) display. Therefore, as long as on your current active display are none of navigation related fields, GPS stays in ULTRA. As soon as you switch to display with any of those fields, watch switch to best in order to give you info what you are requesting - ETA/ETE or remaining distance… you can look at it, note it and then switch back to display without these fields. watches should switch back to ULTRA. This is how I understand how it works. So, pretty smart, IMHO.

            Suunto S9 Baro Titanium, Ironman l.e.
            Suunto Smart Sensor
            Wahoo Tickr FIT
            Hammerhead Karoo 2

            Swim Ride Run Rest Repeat

            Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
            • Brad_OlwinB Offline
              Brad_Olwin Moderator @zadow
              last edited by Brad_Olwin

              @zadow @surfboomerang I am awaiting confirmation from Suunto about this but…
              AFAIK:

              1. Navigation screen will invoke Best GPS only while on Nav screen.
              2. Distance to waypoint/End on any screen will invoke Best GPS no matter battery settings or active screen if route is active.
              3. ETE/ETA fields in any screen will invoke Best GPS no matter battery settings or active screen if route is active.
              4. Altitude profile screen does not invoke Best GPS settings (not sure about this, will test but what I was told).

              I will update this when I know more. I also plan to test this as I have 2 S9 baro watches.

              Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

              Fenr1rF surfboomerangS 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 4
              • Fenr1rF Offline
                Fenr1r @Brad_Olwin
                last edited by

                @brad_olwin 2 & 3 applying regardless of navigation ON/OFF status, AFAYK?

                Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                  Brad_Olwin Moderator @Fenr1r
                  last edited by

                  @fenr1r Changed description, thanks but those fields will show ----------- if no route is loaded.

                  Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                  Fenr1rF 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • Fenr1rF Offline
                    Fenr1r @Brad_Olwin
                    last edited by Fenr1r

                    @brad_olwin

                    Thanks, just working through the permutations!

                    those fields will show ----------- if no route is loaded.

                    Yup: that was the OP’s initial, deliberate condition. Hence the surprise at the GPS still being set to Best in the background without need or ability to display data there.

                    And @zadow’s interesting point about active screens: maybe it works that way without navigation enabled.

                    Something to add to your double-wielding test, if you feel like it.

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                    • surfboomerangS Offline
                      surfboomerang @Brad_Olwin
                      last edited by

                      @brad_olwin Just curious…did you get a response from Suunto?

                      Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
                      OnePlus Nord 4

                      Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                      • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                        Brad_Olwin Moderator @surfboomerang
                        last edited by

                        @surfboomerang More of a discussion. For now, I think what I stated is correct but I should eventually have more information. If you want to use Endurance or Ultra mode at this time with a route loaded I recommend no ETE/ETA fields in custom sport modes or any distance to waypoint fields. Then, Best GPS should only be active when on route Navigation and Good GPS on other screens including the altitude profile screen. Keep bugging me about this and I will check into it. I will also be doing my own testing on long runs over the next two to three weeks.

                        Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                        surfboomerangS 3 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 4
                        • surfboomerangS Offline
                          surfboomerang @Brad_Olwin
                          last edited by

                          @brad_olwin said in Hiking with battery mode Ultra:

                          @surfboomerang More of a discussion.

                          Our opinion of how it should work differs from Suunto’s opinion? 😄

                          Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
                          OnePlus Nord 4

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                          • surfboomerangS Offline
                            surfboomerang @Brad_Olwin
                            last edited by

                            @brad_olwin Any news about the discussion outcome?

                            Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
                            OnePlus Nord 4

                            Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                            • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                              Brad_Olwin Moderator @surfboomerang
                              last edited by Brad_Olwin

                              @surfboomerang Nope, I will update when I know more. I think that WP distance fields and ETE/ETA fields may like stay as implemented. Users dislike “————“ being displayed as typically one thinks something is broken. The real question is whether Best GPS fix can be off unless the user is looking at these fields in the watch face. I would prefer it this way but still awaiting information on this. For now, when a route is loaded and no fields for distance/ETE/ETA the only screen that will revert to Best fix is the route screen itself.

                              Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                              surfboomerangS Fenr1rF 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 1
                              • surfboomerangS Offline
                                surfboomerang @Brad_Olwin
                                last edited by

                                @brad_olwin Best GPS can also be off if the value is “----” even if i’m looking at these fields.
                                Btw, do you know how the Suunto Plus “Weather” screen influences this behaviour? This screen also takes ETA into account right?

                                Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
                                OnePlus Nord 4

                                Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • Fenr1rF Offline
                                  Fenr1r @Brad_Olwin
                                  last edited by Fenr1r

                                  @brad_olwin said in Hiking with battery mode Ultra:

                                  Users dislike “————“ being displayed as typically one thinks something is broken

                                  What do these fields actually read when Nav is inactive (but GPS is switched on by their presence)? As currently implemented, if I understand S9s correctly. Sb’s original point was that no route was loaded.

                                  As one has to activate Navigation manually, isn’t the value-less-ness more a clear indication/reminder that the user hasn’t done so? A step not taken, rather than something broken?

                                  The real question is whether Best GPS fix can be off unless the user is looking at these fields in the watch face. I would prefer it this way but still awaiting information on this.

                                  Also a very valid, if different usage case.

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                                  • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                                    Brad_Olwin Moderator @surfboomerang
                                    last edited by

                                    @surfboomerang said in Hiking with battery mode Ultra:

                                    @brad_olwin Best GPS can also be off if the value is “----” even if i’m looking at these fields.
                                    Btw, do you know how the Suunto Plus “Weather” screen influences this behaviour? This screen also takes ETA into account right?

                                    Excellent point and frankly, I have not tested this since the Endurance/Ultra modes were fixed (there was a long time where this was broken in test firmware) as I need a long run and both S9s. I will soon though and I think we need long runs >3h to get good information on this. I have been hampered by snow as I am this weekend and won’t run sloppy trails when I can SkiMo fresh pow…these modes don’t work for SkiMo:)

                                    Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                                    surfboomerangS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
                                    • surfboomerangS Offline
                                      surfboomerang @Brad_Olwin
                                      last edited by

                                      @brad_olwin Just curious… any new information in the meantime?

                                      Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
                                      OnePlus Nord 4

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                      • surfboomerangS Offline
                                        surfboomerang @Brad_Olwin
                                        last edited by

                                        @brad_olwin said in Hiking with battery mode Ultra:

                                        @surfboomerang More of a discussion. For now, I think what I stated is correct but I should eventually have more information. If you want to use Endurance or Ultra mode at this time with a route loaded I recommend no ETE/ETA fields in custom sport modes or any distance to waypoint fields. Then, Best GPS should only be active when on route Navigation and Good GPS on other screens including the altitude profile screen. Keep bugging me about this and I will check into it. I will also be doing my own testing on long runs over the next two to three weeks.

                                        No new information yet?

                                        Suunto Vertical Titanium Solar
                                        OnePlus Nord 4

                                        Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                                          Brad_Olwin Moderator @surfboomerang
                                          last edited by

                                          @surfboomerang Nope.

                                          Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                                          Łukasz SzmigielŁ 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • Łukasz SzmigielŁ Offline
                                            Łukasz Szmigiel @Brad_Olwin
                                            last edited by

                                            @brad_olwin I’m commenting on this from S5 user’s perspective, which shares some firmware and is related to some extent (by default not “Ultra” but “Good”, that is - 1 min fix mode). If it’s necessary - I’ll create a separate thread in S5 forum.

                                            I went on a hike today on a route I know well so I thought I’ll go with orange mode which in S5 means no OHR and 1 min fix (Endurance in S9).

                                            I didn’t load a route in watch. However - I have ETA on my second screen as I have only one hiking profile that I usually use with navigation and routes loaded. I have two data screens - one related purely to ETAs so if no route is loaded I simply disregard this screen and all is well.

                                            I did notice that the watch didn’t switch to 1 min fix after initial 1 s warmup that lasts a while and it used 1 s fix for the whole activity.

                                            Why I believe this is a problem?

                                            • I got 20+ hours of estimated battery life (starting at ~70%) which was impossible in such conditions. After 2:48 hours of activity (GPS + Galileo) I was left with 51%.
                                            • I didn’t get a notification while starting the activity that the watch is unable to lock on 1 minute fix despite my preference because I’m using ETA on my screens (an easy solution that would take away the confusion why the battery is dead way sooner than expected and maybe the watch is faulty - just tell the user what’s going on if it’s not obvious).
                                            • The watch didn’t record ascent / descent as per 1 min fix mode (S5 can’t do this in other mode than 1 s fix) - but in fact the ETA field forced 1 s fix mode for the whole activity. So it kind of switched to performance but at the same time it didn’t.

                                            The solution?

                                            • Simplest: Just tell people what’s going on after pressing the middle (start) button when watchface configuration (ETAs) interferes with battery settings. Display a message with ability to change the setting or accept it (top / bottom button).
                                            • Better: Same as above but make it route dependent. Let me use 1 minute fix when using ETA on screen if there’s no route loaded - it’s not used anyway, blank field not doing anything. Switch to 1 s after loading the route and display the message when loading the route (the battery life will suffer as we need more precision blah blah are you sure).
                                            • Best: Calculate ETA with less precision? Like - this seems obvious that if navigation data is refreshed rarely then ETA calculation will be less accurate. Maybe use parts of snap to route to achieve this?

                                            S9PP 2.40.44

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