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    S9 v. 2.4.14 GPS performance and practical questions it raises

    Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Suunto 9
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    • ? Offline
      A Former User
      last edited by A Former User

      I have somewhat mixed feelings about the GPS improvements in the latest 2.4.14 firmware upgrade. I think the previous version (2.1.64) fared better. Here’s a case in point – a section of my 20-miler last Sunday, all of it in the wide open space, without tall buildings or trees. On the left is the track captured by Suunto 9 with best GPS quality, and on the right the track from a lowly Polar M430:

      0_1539784331657_S9Track.PNG 0_1539784347249_M430Track.PNG

      Notice how S9 track wanders around and has me running off the track and in the bushes. The practical consequence of this was 0.6 miles difference between the two watches at the end of my run.

      Am I the only one seeing the tracks like this? And if you are seeing similar GPS performance too, how do you deal with it on longer distances where the error starts to accumulate like compound interest? Last but not least, Polar and Garmin allow you to set your pace/distance from a foot pod, but Suunto relies on FusedSpeed. To what extent footpod provided pace figures in that?

      Luís PintoL 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
        Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager
        last edited by

        There is no track GPS FW change since the prev fw if that helps.

        However I have seen cases on the S9 that suddenly for more than 1 move it becomes unstable. I have reported all those to the devs and Sony is looking into it.

        The response I got was to reset the FW.

        Well that sucks…

        However if you are a bit nerdy you can preform a reset via drag and drop the same FW (it exists in the Suunto link data folder and it’s something like ibizaXXX.2.4.16.zip).

        That should avoid reseting things like zones and will wipe caches (reboot doesnt) .

        I do GPS testing every day for Suunto and I got stuck at 3/3 bad tracks for the first time on the S9 some weeks ago. The above helped and I would suggest todo that if the track you are having becomes more than 2 times bad. (as seen in the pic)

        Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
        Creator of Quantified-Self.io
        youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
        https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
        https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

        ? 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
        • ? Offline
          A Former User @Dimitrios Kanellopoulos
          last edited by

          @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos Thank you. Will be doing two more runs this week on that field. If things go same way, will definitely try a reset. Let me dig around Suuntolink, see where the firmware goodies are kept.

          Here’s an interesting observation: for the first 2-3 miles, at least, both watches were fairly close. Mile lap buzzed up within 10-15 m of each other. Then things started diverging.

          Dimitrios KanellopoulosD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
            Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager @Guest
            last edited by

            @NickK Just remember. Each watch can have it’s bad day.

            I run with 3S9 (no joke) and other Spartans (in total about 5 watches) and not all perform good. Somedays one wins and somedays another.

            Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
            Creator of Quantified-Self.io
            youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
            https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
            https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

            Frédéric FiandinoF ? suzzloS 3 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 1
            • Frédéric FiandinoF Offline
              Frédéric Fiandino @Dimitrios Kanellopoulos
              last edited by

              @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos 5 watches … wrists and ankles! Suunto is mistreating you!

              Race
              S9P with a firmware too
              SSSWHR with a firmware inside
              Ambit 3 Run

              https://runalyze.com/athlete/Fred13270

              Dimitrios KanellopoulosD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
                Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager @Frédéric Fiandino
                last edited by

                @Frédéric-Fiandino @Brad_Olwin should describe the collection hehe. Small Suunto museum almost.

                Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
                Creator of Quantified-Self.io
                youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

                Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                • ? Offline
                  A Former User @Dimitrios Kanellopoulos
                  last edited by A Former User

                  @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos Yes, I know. I’m certainly not judging by that single run. I did three with this watch thus far outside. One was pretty good, one was fair, and this was the third. So, the jury is definitely out as to whether even a reset is warranted.

                  Do you know if FusedSpeed with us to stay as the only option or Suunto might consider driving pace/distance by GPS or footpod too, i.e. have a selection between Fused, GPS, or footpod? That would be awesome!

                  Dimitrios KanellopoulosD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
                    Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager @Guest
                    last edited by

                    @NickK I think Suunto when GPS is low biases more to watch + accelerometes = Fused speed.

                    I am not 100% sure how this works with pods and autocalibration but I think it gets more complex there.

                    However, when the pod is on autocalibration off, it only listens to the pod for distance and speed making the GPS a thing only for tracking not for speed etc.

                    Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
                    Creator of Quantified-Self.io
                    youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                    https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                    https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                    • ? Offline
                      A Former User
                      last edited by A Former User

                      Of course this has not much to do with GPS running performance, but with performance in general:

                      That DC guy again:

                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W829SSge2Do

                      GPS performance was not so bad, until it suddenly stopped at all (8.22min).

                      Dimitrios KanellopoulosD ? 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
                        Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager @Guest
                        last edited by Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

                        @paradize we saw that and I almost cried due to the BUG that is on Sony’s side AFAIK. (if you notice also Vantage has it)

                        I tested the S9 on a daily basis of 30+ days 2KM swimming per day (sometimes more) and I had great and the best tracks ever from any watch.

                        Its a pitty this happened to Ray to be honest.

                        FYI feel free to see my tracks they are with 2.4.14 (and 2.4.12) (same GPS FW)

                        Movescount: http://www.movescount.com/members/member1041771-JimmyKane (check August)
                        Strava : http://strava.com/athletes/dimitrioskanellopoulos (again Aug-Sept)

                        Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
                        Creator of Quantified-Self.io
                        youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                        https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                        https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                        • suzzloS Offline
                          suzzlo Moderator @Dimitrios Kanellopoulos
                          last edited by

                          @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in S9 v. 2.4.14 GPS performance and practical questions it raises:

                          I run with 3S9 (no joke) and other Spartans (in total about 5 watches) and not all perform good

                          Do you ever add a Polar or a Garmin to comparisons?

                          (I can imagine you charging all of them at home, there are not enough plugs in the world 😆 😆 😆 )

                          Suunto: Race, S9Peak, Spartan Sport Wrist
                          Garmin: FR745, Edge 530
                          SA topics:

                          • Guides - https://forum.suunto.com/tags/guides
                          Dimitrios KanellopoulosD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
                            Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager @suzzlo
                            last edited by

                            @suzzlo yes a a lot of times. Coming from M400 - V800 (before SSU) and F5/F5+

                            Another pal of mine is also testing 935FR.

                            Suunto in testing has from all brands watches. They don’t go blind.

                            I test in hard conditions, mostly, and less on road lately (did a lot in NL).

                            • I do mountain
                            • Trail (run/hike)
                            • Alpine (run/hike)
                            • Swimming (indoors/outdoors)

                            I don’t hide my tests. I have a main device, my S9, that I love and the rest sit most day on a desk on a wooden branch like here (the devices I have lately and will be keeping):

                            Watches.jpeg

                            Regarding the main device:

                            • Is on production FW
                            • Is on the non GPS optimal hand (right)
                            • Is always the first watch to the wrist.
                            • The main device is the activities you see everywhere
                            • You can check pics that I attach, some are speficially to show the conditions.

                            Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
                            Creator of Quantified-Self.io
                            youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                            https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                            https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

                            ? 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                            • Luís PintoL Offline
                              Luís Pinto Platinum Member @Guest
                              last edited by

                              @NickK You can get pace and distance from Stryd or Milestone for Suunto.

                              SR
                              Site (gr7vel spin): https://youtube.com/channel/UCfHM0mXWS8S61h70Rzj9mfA

                              ? 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • ? Offline
                                A Former User @Guest
                                last edited by

                                @paradize Yes, I’ve seen it. But the takeaway from that video was that all watches but Apple Watch Series 4 weren’t good at open water swimming me thinks, at least for DCR. His Girl fared way better. Though as DCR pointed out, it has less to do with GPS performance per se, and more with algorithms. Or Sony chipset bugs as indeed, both Suunto 9 and Vantage V displayed surprisingly similar behavior for two distinct platforms…

                                Now, I love Apple Watch and kudos for getting things so tight, but my Suunto 9 easily lasts 4-5 days on a single charge with hours of GPS training and OHR and produces data I can export anywhere. Not to mention it looks solid like a rock and can probably survive a nuclear war. Oh, and it has buttons that are easy to press even when wearing gloves 😂

                                I’m not sure Apple Watch would ever become a serious training tool. Not because Apple can’t, but because Apple doesn’t want to. That’s not their core competence.

                                SlaShS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                • ? Offline
                                  A Former User @Luís Pinto
                                  last edited by

                                  @Luís-Pinto I know. Except there’s nowhere in the settings (like with Polar or Garmin) to use footpod for pace/distance as opposed to FusedSpeed or GPS.

                                  My understanding is that FusedSpeed would use a footpod data if it is connected, but it will be one of the inputs. Not the sole input. I think the only way to force Stryd to be a sole provider is to turn off GPS, which kind of defies the purpose.

                                  Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Luís PintoL 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
                                    Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager @Guest
                                    last edited by

                                    My understanding is that FusedSpeed would use a footpod data if it is connected, but it will be one of the inputs. Not the sole input. I think the only way to force Stryd to be a sole provider is to turn off GPS, which kind of defies the purpose.

                                    @NickK No that is not true

                                    If you turn off autocalibration then the Speed/Distance will come from Stryd only and GPS will only be used to carve the track.

                                    Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
                                    Creator of Quantified-Self.io
                                    youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                                    https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                                    https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

                                    Luís PintoL ? 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                    • Luís PintoL Offline
                                      Luís Pinto Platinum Member @Guest
                                      last edited by

                                      @NickK I see your point. We have never really been clarified by Suunto if the Fusespeed works with the footpod or is deactivated from the moment the footpod is connected to the watch.

                                      SR
                                      Site (gr7vel spin): https://youtube.com/channel/UCfHM0mXWS8S61h70Rzj9mfA

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                                      • Luís PintoL Offline
                                        Luís Pinto Platinum Member @Dimitrios Kanellopoulos
                                        last edited by

                                        @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos Thats my notion too. I always put stryd with autocalib off. Because with autocalib on, the gps enter in action for pace and distance and in consequence Fusedspeed.

                                        SR
                                        Site (gr7vel spin): https://youtube.com/channel/UCfHM0mXWS8S61h70Rzj9mfA

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                                        • ? Offline
                                          A Former User @Dimitrios Kanellopoulos
                                          last edited by

                                          @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in S9 v. 2.4.14 GPS performance and practical questions it raises:

                                          I have a main device, my S9, that I love

                                          There! Can I second this opinion?

                                          and the rest sit most day on a desk on a wooden branch like here

                                          Man, and I was thinking something was wrong with me and was going to sell my collection. Now let me proudly grab a similar wooden branch my wife will probably kill me with, once she realizes just how many Suunto, Polar, and Garmin units have been conveniently stuffed in various drawers.

                                          Regarding the main device:

                                          • Is on the non GPS optimal hand (right)

                                          Can you elaborate on that? Why it’s not GPS optimal? Because right is dominant? (I happen to wear my Suunto 9 on the right hand too but mostly because I’m ambidextrous and tend to prefer right for watches)

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                                          • Dimitrios KanellopoulosD Offline
                                            Dimitrios Kanellopoulos Community Manager
                                            last edited by Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

                                            @NickK said in S9 v. 2.4.14 GPS performance and practical questions it raises:

                                            Can you elaborate on that? Why it’s not GPS optimal? Because right is dominant? (I happen to wear my Suunto 9 on the right hand too but mostly because I’m ambidextrous and tend to prefer right for watches)

                                            Exactly the same reason I wear it on right. My problem is also that my right-hand does have a black tattoo and I get the tatoogate thingy and even Vantage cannot get the OHR. They just don’t report any values.

                                            Back to the question about why I can list a few reasons such indeed the dominant hand that moves a lot more but most importantly it’s the side of your body that you tend to have cover at roads and trails.

                                            As used in our society we walk to the right side of the payment for example. In this case, our hand is covered more bu obstacles such as building etc. Same happens when on the trail and you have the trees on one side.

                                            Of course, you could change the way you walk or run and then it wont be at the “bad” arm but then again, now you know why I call the right “bad”.

                                            Community Manager / Admin @Suunto
                                            Creator of Quantified-Self.io
                                            youtube.com/c/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                                            https://instagram.com/dimitrioskanellopoulos
                                            https://www.strava.com/athletes/7586105

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