@Manuel-Extreme That is fine to disagree, I more interested in science and not confirmation bias as it is mostly noticeable with these metrics. HRV value might be useful if used correctly, but there is still a lot of debate when it is correct and not impacted by random things. Bodybattery is build on few numbers, so it cannot really represent how does one feel or not, it can show some trend for training, but that is it it is definitely not the window to overall health, far from it. Yes - accurate sleep tracking is very good thing, the problem is none of the devices can track that accurately, unless you mean sleep time, but that I can tell you without a watch. Everyone can read into those numbers whatever they want, but some things have strong scientific background and some do not. And for most of the wellness metrics the answer - they do not.

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@OutdoorMan agreed. Curious to see how useful it is but I like that they are outside of the box right now. Recording notes and now this are interesting

@VoiGAS said in Are now all Suunto Watches made in China?: @zhangschmidt Dive computers I was wondering if it could be those. Defects/bugs there are an immediate red alert (or were, the last time I made it to Vantaa).

another 2 options Vertical buttons / military look / luminous inside vector watchface aesthetics minimal [image: 1770387927424-gemini_generated_image_2o3iug2o3iug2o3i.png] tank built [image: 1770391447607-gemini_generated_image_jm82fdjm82fdjm82.png]

@tuxbuster yeah, but trainings work different with Garmin and Suunto. In Suunto the one who delivers the Guide is responsible for the metrics displayed and their labels. Suunto could make it easier, possibly. Here you find a definition of the API uses by Suunto… WIthin Garmin the training objections are defined, not what is displayed on the watch…

Primarily useful for marketing departments.

@maszop the compass itself is quick on an Epix Pro - seen in the ABC widget. But painting the rotating map is choppy… I add one to the list: Giving me the last notification from the phone as soon as I’m in reach of Bluetooth again after a run without my phone.

@Tomas5 well, they better get going with some serious software updates then.

@safari I still use mine. It’s the oldest, has seen the most wear and tear, and is irreplaceable. It’s never been serviced, the battery is great, and it performs wonderfully in the pool. Next Monday, I’m sending my current Suunto Vertical for service for the second time (…) so Ambit is back in the game!

@raven I do. Finnish people getting paid to implement Finnish design meant something at least.

@Egika I thought the same, but I seen some year old activities in Italia. Also I didn’t manage to find the filter

All the Vertical, Race(s) and Ocean are great upgrades. Best in class GPS. But if you don’t mind the OLED and want the greatest, the most beautiful and ‘Made in Finland’ get the Ocean. I have the 3 in case you wonder why I suggest the Ocean (oh and if money is no prob since it’s more expensive)

Having tried the Ai running program from Garmin, I’m not a big fan. Changing runs overnight (from a tempo run to a rest day on one occasion and from an easy run to intervals on another - even though the same run had already been carried out that week) and during the course of a day was a little to much for me.

Design / looks Overall accuracy in things that matter for me (gps/ altitude / pace ) Ease of use Robustness of the watch What it stands for (the image of the brand , it brings up emotions with positive connotations) The app It has its flaws but I keep promoting it as a brand that I trust and value

@Ghost great answer clarifing what i was thinking. Thanks.

@BenjiBoy try This one: https://www.juwelen-binder.at/index.php/start-os/core-strap?srsltid=AfmBOoodLoG8ov-15UJmpKthVHTxORMXcZfiH5FDuEeZoJ67KQZmVgf-

Thanks @2b2bff , @TonyG for your sharing your experience! In my particular case, since swimming is just a complimentary activity and hence my swimming technique is rather poor, I didn’t had the elements to say if the hit or miss of style identification was my fault or not. So, first step: improve technique . Going back to the opening question: I understand there’s no reason for the Garmin Swim unless you’re specifically targeting to have the extra analysis that Suuntos may lack of. Or… look for an Ambit . And thanks @TonyG for the tip on having laps better captured: solid push + glide it goes. Cheers!

@VoiGAS said in Cross Country Skiing - how to analyze?: @Brad_Olwin I will definitly try Zonesense at XC Skiing to adjust the effort. I just forgot the belt at home . But how do I know if I improve? At running I have good feedback with VO2MAX, NGP and Power. One way to test improvement is a time trial, or the same route at max effort at beginning of your training, in the middle and then a race effort. I run a lot of the same hills near my home. I can tell during a large training block over the summer that the tough routes get easier and faster showing me my fitness is improving. I can also tell by how I feel after a hard workout. I guess I am much more subjective and pay attention more to how I feel. I do not trust recovery metrics other than my min HR at night, my rest HR and how I feel. I think most non-professional individuals place too much emphasis on numbers and not on their effort and how they feel. Take it or leave it, my personal opinion. I have been active all of my life, raced road bikes for 12y in my 30s and 40s, was a fully certified ski instructor for 12y and now running ultras for the last ~15 years. I am fairly laid back about my numbers but my training is very consistent and planned, I have long range and short range goals. I am 68 so definitely not at the fitness I could achieve in my 30s and 40s but I still beat a lot of 50y old ultra runners in races.