@Mennekk You misused the autolap on your garmin for structured workouts. I cannot blame suunto for not supporting your misuse, but I understand it’s a bummer if hacks you use to be able to use don’t work anymore and you have to find an other way (structured workouts) Just as on my garmins, on my suunto I have a running profile (with 1k autolap) and interval profile without autolap. Then you can configure any datafield you want. (At first I thought what strange that you cannot edit existing profiles but have to start a new one from scratch. But on a garmin it isn’t much else. You can edit the existing profile, delete all datascreens and basically start from scratch. And then create a new one for intervals, with different datascreens)

@sky-runner While I have nowhere near the experience you do with using navigation in areas as described above, I have reported navigation issues where even when you are doing a simple out and back, if you do not complete the out portion and decide to turn around early it will also turn into a nightmare. It will stop climb guidance, it will think you are done navigating or it will tell you you are off course. In this situation I am usually hiking so while it is a frustration, I can load the route again and it will usually be back to normal. I would be pretty upset if I were in the middle of a race and had the same issue. Garmin can be funky with turn by turn when a route is not complete in an out and back and give some funky numbers for a while, but the climb pro never stops and it will figure it out. (maybe because it does have routable maps vs Suunto laying lines on a picture,) Coros has been the best at recognizing these types of changes while using turn by turn, but there is no climb guidance and I have been pretty stubborn about giving that up.

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@Mitch9 said in Rumors and dreams: @OutdoorMan Then the text is really, really strange. It’s marketing and building hype. You have to catch customers somehow, I don’t see it as strange.

Primarily useful for marketing departments.

@maszop the compass itself is quick on an Epix Pro - seen in the ABC widget. But painting the rotating map is choppy… I add one to the list: Giving me the last notification from the phone as soon as I’m in reach of Bluetooth again after a run without my phone.

@Tomas5 well, they better get going with some serious software updates then.

@safari I still use mine. It’s the oldest, has seen the most wear and tear, and is irreplaceable. It’s never been serviced, the battery is great, and it performs wonderfully in the pool. Next Monday, I’m sending my current Suunto Vertical for service for the second time (…) so Ambit is back in the game!

@raven I do. Finnish people getting paid to implement Finnish design meant something at least.

@Egika I thought the same, but I seen some year old activities in Italia. Also I didn’t manage to find the filter

All the Vertical, Race(s) and Ocean are great upgrades. Best in class GPS. But if you don’t mind the OLED and want the greatest, the most beautiful and ‘Made in Finland’ get the Ocean. I have the 3 in case you wonder why I suggest the Ocean (oh and if money is no prob since it’s more expensive)

Having tried the Ai running program from Garmin, I’m not a big fan. Changing runs overnight (from a tempo run to a rest day on one occasion and from an easy run to intervals on another - even though the same run had already been carried out that week) and during the course of a day was a little to much for me.

Design / looks Overall accuracy in things that matter for me (gps/ altitude / pace ) Ease of use Robustness of the watch What it stands for (the image of the brand , it brings up emotions with positive connotations) The app It has its flaws but I keep promoting it as a brand that I trust and value

@Ghost great answer clarifing what i was thinking. Thanks.

@BenjiBoy try This one: https://www.juwelen-binder.at/index.php/start-os/core-strap?srsltid=AfmBOoodLoG8ov-15UJmpKthVHTxORMXcZfiH5FDuEeZoJ67KQZmVgf-

@VoiGAS think a combination of Suunto Race s / Vertical ti rugged design with Suunto alpha core display… A orientated tactical watch. Eg luminox invictus [image: 1738683020942-img_20250204_172806.jpg] [image: 1738683020988-img_20250204_172739.jpg] [image: 1738683021025-img_20250204_172725.jpg]

Thanks @2b2bff , @TonyG for your sharing your experience! In my particular case, since swimming is just a complimentary activity and hence my swimming technique is rather poor, I didn’t had the elements to say if the hit or miss of style identification was my fault or not. So, first step: improve technique . Going back to the opening question: I understand there’s no reason for the Garmin Swim unless you’re specifically targeting to have the extra analysis that Suuntos may lack of. Or… look for an Ambit . And thanks @TonyG for the tip on having laps better captured: solid push + glide it goes. Cheers!

@VoiGAS said in Cross Country Skiing - how to analyze?: @Brad_Olwin I will definitly try Zonesense at XC Skiing to adjust the effort. I just forgot the belt at home . But how do I know if I improve? At running I have good feedback with VO2MAX, NGP and Power. One way to test improvement is a time trial, or the same route at max effort at beginning of your training, in the middle and then a race effort. I run a lot of the same hills near my home. I can tell during a large training block over the summer that the tough routes get easier and faster showing me my fitness is improving. I can also tell by how I feel after a hard workout. I guess I am much more subjective and pay attention more to how I feel. I do not trust recovery metrics other than my min HR at night, my rest HR and how I feel. I think most non-professional individuals place too much emphasis on numbers and not on their effort and how they feel. Take it or leave it, my personal opinion. I have been active all of my life, raced road bikes for 12y in my 30s and 40s, was a fully certified ski instructor for 12y and now running ultras for the last ~15 years. I am fairly laid back about my numbers but my training is very consistent and planned, I have long range and short range goals. I am 68 so definitely not at the fitness I could achieve in my 30s and 40s but I still beat a lot of 50y old ultra runners in races.

Early days yet but the screen is fabulous