Nov transition update

[Adam Lantos]

@pgrey 100% agree! There is also the effect on the developers themselves, no way everyone working on SA/MC agrees with this decision, so Suunto may lose a portion of their dedicated workforce over this. It’s an incredibly short-sighted move on their part.

At least I got to try a Garmin, so far pretty impressed with the watch and Garmin’s app/website.

[freeheeler]

@Adam-Lantos
why should they not be motivated and how do you know?

[fejker]

@TELE-HO usually a company has it’s philosophy and workers, if they want to keep their sanity and be happier at a workplace, agree with this philosophy and make it work - they feel good because they are not going against the grain and are cooperating with their employer. If one of these things shift, either the company changes their philosophy (usually happens when there is a merger or take-over) or the employees have a mind shift, then usually things go downhill - sometimes faster, other times it takes a couple of years.

[A Former User]

I guess they are trying to calm down people by providing a solution…but Suunto costumers want full featured solution not some workarounds.
I simply can’t understand why they don’t open source the firmware (or the part that makes sports modes, uplaods POIs, gpx, etc) so other projects like the openambit can make something.
From the day I bought my Ambit 2 Sapphire that suunto was never reliable on their online side (movescount was down several times)…that for a watch that relly on that site was not good.
Why not taking this as opportunity and change?
I am now an Ambit 3 costumer and don’t move because I don’t need anything more. If it stops to work we will see…I think suunto is improving on S9, and that is nice and valuable, but I guess they need to take concrete decisions like the grown up company that they are, not some workarounds like some new company.

[Adam Lantos]

@André-Faria said in Nov transition update:

I simply can’t understand why they don’t open source the firmware (or the part that makes sports modes, uplaods POIs, gpx, etc) so other projects like the openambit can make something.

That would be awesome. Ambit3 hardware with open source firmware would be a geek’s dream, think pebble watch, but much better

But, it’s extremely unlikely to happen, unless the code was already written in way that could easily be open sourced. Otherwise every single patent troll out there would go and look at the code to find reasons to sue Suunto for copyright/patent/license infringement. It’s a giant pain, which is why most software companies don’t choose the open source route, unless they are forced to.

[petmic]

@Adam-Lantos said in Nov transition update:

@André-Faria said in Nov transition update:

I simply can’t understand why they don’t open source the firmware (or the part that makes sports modes, uplaods POIs, gpx, etc) so other projects like the openambit can make something.

That would be awesome. Ambit3 hardware with open source firmware would be a geek’s dream, think pebble watch, but much better

But, it’s extremely unlikely to happen, unless the code was already written in way that could easily be open sourced. Otherwise every single patent troll out there would go and look at the code to find reasons to sue Suunto for copyright/patent/license infringement. It’s a giant pain, which is why most software companies don’t choose the open source route, unless they are forced to.

I think there is no need to open the watch firmware. It would be sufficient to publish the communication protocol so people out there (openambit) could write their own code for changing sport modes, tranfering POI + routes, structured training e.t.c
This way Suunto will not have to give anything from their patents that are related to the watch code (like Fusedspeed, FusedAlti e.t.c). So no harm done to them.
I personally think it is Suunto’s policy not to allow the user not to rely on Suutno’s services. Even if it means the watches will be rendered unusable in the future. A shame really.

[crmoore]

@petmic said in Nov transition update:

I personally think it is Suunto’s policy not to allow the user not to rely on Suutno’s services. Even if it means the watches will be rendered unusable in the future. A shame really.

Are any of the current-generation watches any different? I know old-school Garmins were fully usable with the PC software, but I haven’t used one in quite some years. Coros looks tied to their cloud, Polar is completely unknown to me.

Opening the protocol would do much to satisfy me. In fact it would be a huge differentiator and selling point.

[A Former User]

@Adam-Lantos said in Nov transition update:

@André-Faria said in Nov transition update:

I simply can’t understand why they don’t open source the firmware (or the part that makes sports modes, uplaods POIs, gpx, etc) so other projects like the openambit can make something.

That would be awesome. Ambit3 hardware with open source firmware would be a geek’s dream, think pebble watch, but much better

But, it’s extremely unlikely to happen, unless the code was already written in way that could easily be open sourced. Otherwise every single patent troll out there would go and look at the code to find reasons to sue Suunto for copyright/patent/license infringement. It’s a giant pain, which is why most software companies don’t choose the open source route, unless they are forced to.

What I meant to say was protocol

@crmoore said in Nov transition update:

@petmic said in Nov transition update:

I personally think it is Suunto’s policy not to allow the user not to rely on Suutno’s services. Even if it means the watches will be rendered unusable in the future. A shame really.

Are any of the current-generation watches any different? I know old-school Garmins were fully usable with the PC software, but I haven’t used one in quite some years. Coros looks tied to their cloud, Polar is completely unknown to me.

Opening the protocol would do much to satisfy me. In fact it would be a huge differentiator and selling point.

I think most garmins are fully usable offline, and when connected to the pc are mounted like a drive, and allow to extract the files from there.
Don’t know about newer suunto watches, on ambit if you connect to movescount, you can take out the activities, but you can’t change sport profiles or upload gpx.

[sascha]

Our web service will continue to evolve in 2020 (…) for Ambit (1, 2 and 3) and Traverse family watches only?

[jthomi]

@sascha Exactly.

[petmic]

Is there any news about the transition? Any recent announcement that I have missed?

[halajos]

The time for transition is nearing, and I’ve got a couple of questions:

• apart from activity metrics what is transferred from MC? AFAIK pictures are, tags aren’t.
• are transferred activities synced to already set-up partner connections?
• are any manual updates to the activities (like giving the activity a name) synced to partners?

[Dimitrios Kanellopoulos]

@halajos said in Nov transition update:

are transferred activities synced to already set-up partner connections?
are any manual updates to the activities (like giving the activity a name) synced to partners?

Those have been discussed. No tags, no partner push for previous activities (as it is currently also for new users etc), Partner manual edits such as description is pushed but not a second time.

[A Former User]

Recent news:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2020/09/suunto-announces-final-steps-for-movescount-transition-not-all-bad-news.html

[Ennoch]

@André-Faria

That’s an interesting read, although like anything I’ll take it with a pinch of salt.

Looks like the end is nigh for me as a Suunto user because there is still no desktop application to allow for syncing, route creation etc. I’ve said it before on here until I’m blue in the face; I am not using a bloody phone to create routes. Post 13th October, the setup is non-workable for me.

I am also not paying extra for a premium product (Strava etc) which allows me to create routes effectively, to then save it, email it to my phone/save to dropbox etc, to then have to sync to the watch via my phone - when I chose Suunto it was after a lot of deliberation and it also took Movescount into consideration. And of course POI’s are still promised, and still not delivered. Suunto continue to offer the most frustrating product experience of anything I’ve bought in the last ten years. The crux here is that if the current setup of Spartan + App was the offering when I bought the watch, I would never have bought it.

[Fenr1r]

@André-Faria Thanks for posting that.

The suspension of the loyalty offer between Nov 20 & Dec 1, which DCR connects to discount season, is interesting. Does the loyalty of Spartan, Ambit & Traverse owners somehow become markedly less valuable over those particular days? Are they back to being regular punters (presumably with watches that will be re-enabled by a Movescount web fully reactivated just for that period)?

Wouldn’t maintaining the scheme through that period make more sense in terms of loyalty-appreciation? Consistent discount on the prices, whatever they would be, suggests sincerity. Interruptions (perhaps while Suunto courts new buyers): not so much.

[isazi]

@Fenr1r that’s Thanksgiving/BlackFriday week. You get more than 30% discount looking around.

[Fenr1r]

@isazi Yup: that’s my point. Rather than having loyalty rewarded, for that period S,A&T owners are back on the same level as everyone else. Probably a bit annoyed, having taken advantage of the offer, if a My First Suunto buyer picked up something at “more than 30% discount looking around”.

Sincerity would be applying the offer on top of the discounted price, wherever the watch was found, maybe via arrangement with secondary retailer, maybe by reimbursement from Suunto directly with proof of purchase.

Remember, the choice of timing on all of this was all Suunto’s. Could’ve kept MCweb going until Dec 1. Offer begins therafter. Or until Jan X, to get beyond post-holiday sales. Whenever there was a 6 month gap between major sales to follow. (If such exists globally, to be fair.)

[Ennoch]

I just had a rather frustrating call with one off the UK Tech support guys who tried to tell me that I did not purchase Movescount as a facility but only purchased the Spartan and thus they have the right to remove all functionality, i.e. route creation and POI’s at their will.

Indeed he even went as far as to tell me POI’s were not part of what I purchased, despite having a manual (thankfully I saved it down rather than relying on the updated online version) which tells me in detail how to add POIs to the watch in a advance of use. I will except Demetrios from this statement but all the other people I have spoken to via email and on the phone from Suunto have been obtuse, arrogant and utterly unhelpful and have only made me feel even more anger towards the brand. Unfortunately I can’t even take the watch back to where I bought it from and make it their problem because I bought it direct from Suunto.

All I want is what I purchased and what I currently have; I’m happy with it. It’s like buying a performance car and the manufacturer deciding at the annual service to ‘upgrade’ your engine from the 4.0 V8 to a 2.2 I4.

[Gábor Tóth]

@Ennoch At least you still have a cable - what enables you to can change your watch setting…