Suunto 7 Successor

suzzlo

@dmytro it will depend in the chipset… if they develop a very good chipset that makes a huge step from the actual ones… think about a WearOS chip that can last 3/4 days…

DMytro

@suzzlo True. We shall see about that:)

olymay

@suzzlo @DMytro

Maybe, but I would have thought that Suunto would have a separate team for the S7 and any other potential WearOS developments. It’s been quiet regarding updates for almost a year now, so the current S7 is clearly dead (from a development point of view, it obviously still works fantastically, it just won’t get anything new).

With a pixel watch likely launching this year, it will be the first proper smartwatch with Fitbit baked in. If they can price it properly (and Pixel 6 pricing indicates Google have realised that undercutting the opposition works well) then it could sell really well to the average user. Add in the usual Fossil quality issues, the fact the GW4 is hamstrung without a Galaxy phone, and the WearOS market is currently wide open for a reliable, solid battery life, good quality, well priced watch.

This could be the new S7. With the Suunto health tracking on board it blows all other WearOS devices clear out of the water, nothing else comes close on accuracy, features, battery, etc.
If they can add in the extras that customers want (SPO2, external sensors, training plans, detailed sleep tracking, etc) AND price it competitively (the S7 was FAR too expensive for the average consumer to even consider) then they could have a runaway success and become a big player in the WearOS and smartwatch market.

BUT, if they wait until after the Pixel Watch, much of that market share will have gone. It will be too late and the next gen S7 would be dead on arrival.

At the very least we need some sort of announcement. Leaks, teasers, drips of info help to build interest and anticipation. Google did an amazing job leaking the info about the Pixel 6 and it was the most talked about phone of 2021 (yes, more so than the iPhone). All leaks were intentional by Google, all companies do it to build interest (ok, not all, Garmin don’t do it, but their customers seem to build enough hype on their own).

So please Suunto, give us something…

suzzlo

@olymay said in Suunto 7 Successor:

I would have thought that Suunto would have a separate team for the S7 and any other potential WearOS developments

based on LinkedIn information these are the employee number in each company:

Suunto: 309
Garmin: 7309
Polar: 716
Coros: 51

Not sure if you can have dedicated teams for each device

BR

olymay

@suzzlo I’m sure someone in the know on this forum mentioned that there is a dedicated team working on the WearOS line. That doesn’t mean the team is very big (or if it even still exists).

I really want to stay with Suunto, I love the products and the app (I spent some time in the Garmin app this evening and it looks very childish in comparison).
But I want something more advanced, and if there isn’t a replacement S7 then I will shop around (pains me to say it, but Garmin Fenix 7 / Epix 2 are current favourites).
It essentially comes down to what is announced over the next few weeks as I want to take my training to the next level in 2022.

cosme.costa

@olymay said in Suunto 7 Successor:

But I want something more advanced, and if there isn’t a replacement S7 then I will shop around (pains me to say it, but Garmin Fenix 7 / Epix 2 are current favourites).
It essentially comes down to what is announced over the next few weeks as I want to take my training to the next level in 2022.

No offense here, sincere question here: what do you mean saying that you want to take your training to the next level? What you are going to do? What do you expect to achieve with a new watch that will help you?

I mean, I can understand that someone wants the latest watch with the latest/new/shiny features but this would really help the training? This can also happens with phones and other gadgets.

In my opinion, if you want to improve your training first of all is decide what you want to achieve: general fit, running, cycling, etc. And then focus in the sport/sports you like. As an example and IMHO if you like running, and do you want to improve, first question: what you want to improve: speed, longer distances or both? Important thing is the balance between you body weight and height/body structure, then short and fast for speed, long and steady for longer runs, combined for run faster and longer. Do km and km, up hill/down hill to increase you force, stairs, general core exercises… Do you need to do interval training? In my opinion you can but until you run comfortably under 5:00 min/km there is no much need for interval training…For all this, I do not think you need any advanced tool, only your body and mind and if you want a watch to check if you are improving over the time. But this is my opinion and what I do, so maybe I’m missing something that I could also use.

olymay

@cosme-costa You are absolutely right, do I NEED a top end brand new fancy dancy ultra high tech all singing all dancing do everything watch? No, of course not.
Do I even need a sports watch at all? No, not really.
Do I want one? Yes.

My current goal, as a bloke who is unfit at 188cm and 94kg, is to run a 50km ultramarathon by the end of the year. In a registered event.
Speed is not really important, I just want to finish and not be last.

So why do I want the latest and greatest top end device? Mainly because it helps me psychologically. If I have good kit then I am motivated to use it, and to (try at least) use it to it’s potential.

I also like simplicity. My gf used her Garmin Venu and the built in (free) coach to get her to her first ever half marathon distance. A friend of mine used her Forerunner to train for the London Marathon, again using the built in free coach, They both loved it and said it worked really well for them, especially as it adjusted to them as they went. I like the sound of that. A lot.
I also want a better grasp of my body, and the Garmin body battery and sleep tracing seem pretty decent. I like having them on my S7 but they are seriously basic. A fantastic first attempt at it, but it now needs to step it up to compete.
I want external sensor support so that I can run in the cold and rain without needing to keep my left sleeve part rolled up. And so that I can use it for cycling (once I buy myself a bike etc).

Do I need a Fenix? No. But I want to start as I mean to go on, I want something that will help me every step of my journey, not something I have to upgrade every few years because I’ve hit the limit of what it can do.

I did the same with my photography years ago. I bought a beginner camera and within a month realised it was a mistake, as it didn’t give me the room to learn and grow. So I bought a pro spec camera. Sure, the learning curve was insane, but I put the effort in and got to a good level much faster than I would have otherwise. I was also able to keep that camera throughout my journey and keep consistency.

My logic is similar with a watch. I have the budget to afford the best, so why should I limit myself so something basic simply because I am a beginner? All the gear and no idea? Maybe. Or maybe just someone with ambition and drive.

I’m not saying a Fenix is the only option that will do this, there are many. But that is the current lead choice for me simply because I have seen up close what the Garmin can do (body battery, sleep tracking, training plans, etc) and I know so many people with them.

If I could get something similar with a Suunto then I would stick with Suunto, but it doesn’t look like that option is there at the moment.
Maybe an S7 replacement (if it ever comes, but the radio silence is not filling me with confidence) might do what I want. It might not.
I won’t speculate until an announcement does or doesn’t come.

Sorry, this turned into a much longer post than intended…

cosme.costa

@olymay As I said my question was not with bad intention, and this training coach looks like a good feature.

I see your point, I’ve been where you are but now my approach is a bit different. I prefer make things simple now, too many things to take care make me move slower .

BTW, nice goal you have for this year! Sure you will outperform your initial expectations

Egika

@cosme-costa said in Suunto 7 Successor:

@olymay As I said my question was not with bad intention, and this training coach looks like a good feature.

Suunto has an adaptive training guidance built in the Suunto 3.

olymay

@cosme-costa oh i know it wasn’t bad intention in fact i appreciate questions like this as it makes me think long and hard about my decisions

I want thing to be simple also, which is part of why I want a watch that can essentially manage my training plan for me. I don’t have the inclination or the know how to build a training plan and then keep it up to date as my fitness changes or I miss a session etc. I know I can use a third party system to do this for me, but this is another layer, and as they do not work with the current S7 I either need to write it down or memorise it (remembering what I need to do on a run will not happen, my mind wonders when running).

And a MASSIVE thanks for the encouragement. Like I said, I simply want to survive a 50km run at the moment, and ideally not come last. Anything else is a bonus.
Right now, the furthest I have run is 22.11km (barely a warm up for many on here ) and since then I have had to scale it right back to rest a sore achillies. I’m slowly building back up (currently at 6km). A training plan here would be super useful, I have a habit of getting carried away and pushing too hard (when I went out yesterday I was enjoying the run and really REALLY wanted to keep going, but I didn’t, and i’m glad as ai ran out of gas towards the end).

olymay

@egika said in Suunto 7 Successor:

@cosme-costa said in Suunto 7 Successor:

@olymay As I said my question was not with bad intention, and this training coach looks like a good feature.

Suunto has an adaptive training guidance built in the Suunto 3.

If the same thing were available in the S7 I would be a VERY happy boy

Egika

@olymay Some ideas regading your situation:
For those longer runs you are planning, a dedicated sports watch seems to make sense for you. Like the S9P with it’s state of the art wrist HR sensor and light weight.
Regarding training plans: Have you looked at training peaks and all those free plans you can find there?
Now we just need a way to get the TP plans into our watches…

olymay

@egika Thanks, I really appreciate it

I agree, to get the most out of my longer runs a proper sports watch makes a lot of sense. This is one of the main reasons that I am looking to upgrade the S7 so something more advanced.

I have looked at Training Peaks and it seems to give me most of what I want, for a price. And that price is quite a lot. I don’t mind that if it is worth it, or offers something I can’t get for free. But the Garmin coach is free, as is the adaptive training on the S3. And I would rather not have to use a third party if I can avoid it, purely for simplicity.
But also, TP does not integrate with my S7 at all (it does receive my training data, but will not load anything to the watch regarding a plan etc).

I have looked at the S9P and really love the look of it. It’s also very expensive and for the same money I can get a Fenix 6 Pro with change to spare. It looks to me that the Fenix has better body battery and better sleep tracking, plus has the free coach built in, and links to more services should I want to.
As much as I love the S9P, it seems to lose out to the Fenix in most areas

In an ideal world I want a Suunto 7 that can do most of what the S9P and F6 can do, with proper body battery / resources and detailed sleep tracking with external sensor support and built in coach / training plan.
I realise I’m essentially asking for a unicorn watch (as in one that does not and will never exist) but if I can find the perfect product for me then I am willing to spend the cash to get it.

I guess the next few weeks will be interesting, as I am expecting Garmin to announce the Fenix 7 and Epix 2, and Suunto to announce something (probably S5Peak?)…?

Egika

@olymay I can fully understand and like your attitude
I am also motivated to excercise by new gadgets
Good thing is there will always be new products coming - while I understand that Suunto is a little more focussing on sustainability.

cosme.costa

@olymay Don’t rush, for what I have read in the forum and other places I think/hope Suunto will bring some nice update, I’ve read in some web pages that we will even have structured workouts in 2022. So maybe Suunto releases something sw, hw or both that suits you.

Don’t rush also for your goal, here my two cents: 50 km is not something trivial, and I guess that this ultramarathon takes place in trails and with some ascent, am I right? Anyway, for this distance you need to feel comfortable running around 25/30 km regularly (once a week or every 10 days at comfortable pace, controlling food and water) before you go for the next step. When you achieve that then you need to think of a more structured training, and its here when maybe you need some new gadget, IMHO.
You have said, and I saw in SA, that your last run were 6 km but you felt empty at the end, so build up your shape from here. I mean this week run 6/7 km until you are comfortable, next week try to arrive to 10 km until you are comfortable, then 15 km once per week, then 20 km once per week/10 days and 10 km during week days and so on. Eat very healthy, sometimes changes in the diet don’t pay off until some weeks have passed, learn to eat/drink while running, in a 50 km race this is basic. Rest 2 days a week non consecutives… Do recovery runs, and build up your aerobic range, I mean add km but only force yourself once or two a week.

Probably you can also find tones of trainings for this distance but I’m pretty against them, specific trainings for a single event tend to prepare you well for the event but then your recovery is really long, I’m more in favour of build up a good base and then adapt of what you want to do.

Km to the legs!!

Nigel Taylor 0

@olymay said in Suunto 7 Successor:

I guess the next few weeks will be interesting, as I am expecting Garmin to announce the Fenix 7 and Epix 2, and Suunto to announce something (probably S5Peak?)…?

The sale of Suunto to Liesheng (who have the Haylou brand) might be a bit of a complicating factor with regards to future Suunto watches?

https://www.suunto.com/en-gb/News/new-ownership-broadens-suuntos-shoulders-in-developing-fit-for-purpose-outdoor-products/

Maybe add Suunto activity tracking (and mapping) smarts to something like their RS3 >> https://haylou.info/rs3.html
…and you’ve got a future S7 fork that moves away from Wear OS (which is going to be difficult to compete against Samsung and a future Pixel) - and with that brings along improved battery life.

Jamie BG

@olymay
Also look at FR745 / FR945 / Enduro. Note that new F7 / Epix 2 (F7 with AMOLED - not sure if it loses anything or gains any extra features) are expected to be announced this month (maybe as early as the 17th/18th). No idea yet, other than stamina, whether any new additional features or improvements - so may also be a good time to pick up a second hand as people exchange for a F7.

I went from S7 to F6xPs and have pretty much found everything you point out to be very true, and helped me get from couch to 5k using one of training plans. But have also used other built in plans for strength training, cardio and even a little bit of Yoga - broadening what I do.
Am also seriously getting tempted by what these watches can do with indoor cycles that work in conjunction with the watch - which would be a nice change around for when the weather is bad.

olymay

@cosme-costa I’m happy to wait, but not forever. If new features or devices are coming then at least a rough indication of this and a timescale would be nice. Otherwise customers may think nothing is coming and buy something different. For example, if I knew for certain that a new S7 was coming in Q1/Q2 2022 then I would probably wait to see what it is like (and probably buy it). But not knowing makes me think nothing is coming and I start to look elsewhere.

Mega, thanks for the tips. It aligns roughly with how I was already thinking and it’s really great to know I wasn’t far off the mark.

There is a 50km trail race in December and that is my target. I prefer trails and despise running on tarmac.

Last year I was doing >20km and not completely dying at the end, so I know I can get to that distance again. I then just need to double it
My thoughts were to do another couple of weeks of 5-6 km runs, to build up some base stamina and then start to slowly build up the distance a little each week.
Previously, my schedule was a short (7-10km) run twice a week on weekdays (often tues and thurs) and then a longer run at the weekend. This was mainly governed by working in the week and not having a huge amount of time free to go for a long run.

olymay

@nigel-taylor-0 said in Suunto 7 Successor:

@olymay said in Suunto 7 Successor:

I guess the next few weeks will be interesting, as I am expecting Garmin to announce the Fenix 7 and Epix 2, and Suunto to announce something (probably S5Peak?)…?

The sale of Suunto to Liesheng (who have the Haylou brand) might be a bit of a complicating factor with regards to future Suunto watches?

https://www.suunto.com/en-gb/News/new-ownership-broadens-suuntos-shoulders-in-developing-fit-for-purpose-outdoor-products/

Maybe add Suunto activity tracking (and mapping) smarts to something like their RS3 >> https://haylou.info/rs3.html
…and you’ve got a future S7 fork that moves away from Wear OS (which is going to be difficult to compete against Samsung and a future Pixel) - and with that brings along improved battery life.

Yeah… I’m not sure how I feel about this sale. I’m not positive or negative. But I am, as ever, cautiously optimistic. Who knows what it will bring.

One thing I am confident on though, is there will be change, for better or worse.

olymay

@jamie-bg yeah, they are also some great watches. And if the rumours are true then the FR755 and FR955 will also be announced alongside the F7 and E2.
The same rumours also point towards a Jan 17th date.

The E2 sounds like it will be the same as the F7 but with an AMOLED screen and no solar charging. If it’s not too crazy expensive then this might be the one I look at most, purely because I have become so used to the stunning screen on the S7

If the F6 becomes available for a crazy cheap price then I’ll look at it. But rumours are that the F7 will have better sensors (HR etc), touchscreen (useful for maps), and a bunch of other major upgrades (some useful, some not for me).

I don’t need crazy battery life, as IF I can complete this 50km ultra than it will likely be as far as I go distance wise (mind you, I said that about the half marathon ).

I’m also looking at moving house soon and want to build myself a pain cave / gym area. Part of that is to get a smart bike, a rower, and weights, etc. Having a watch that can track all of that and connect to other bits of tech is going to be crucial, so I am also trying to future proof any purchases.