Reviews
-
@tomasbartko “Some people choose to sleep without sleep stage tracking”. Explorers don’t need this fancy stuff in their tents on a mountain.
But you’re right, that’s probably just marketing to differentiate the products. On the other hand, I could be wrong. Who knows.
I don‘t get that either. If you asked me what Suunto‘s flagship is I‘d answer „Vertical“. Not the Race. The Vertical should be on par with the Race if hardware permits. The Vertical should not artificially be demoted so short after its launch. These marketing moves reduce my trust. But I‘ve had this issue before when I was looking for a Suunto Ambit and then for a Spartan: there are subtle differences, I perceived finding the right model as being somewhat painful to be honest (and I never bought an Ambit because of the Peak/Vertical/Sport „mess“ (my perception back then)). At least sapphire glass is now more or less standard but one still has to watch out for small things.
-
@MKPotts Vertical is to a big part more expensive than Race, because MIP screens are more expensive than AMOLED.
Garmin’s pricing of making AMOLED devices more expensive is a pure marketing descision. Cost based pricing would make them cheaper - as we see it with the Suunto Race.
Made in China adds to this but does not cover all the cost difference. -
@v-sacre said in Reviews:
@Tieutieu Based on DC table about features contained for both models, Vertical won’t have:
- running estimate and HR run threshold
- sleep stages and naps
But I really don’t know on what assumption DC made this table…
Except a “marketing” decision, I also don’t know what hardware limitation would avoid to have this on the SV.
Except a licensing limitation. Or something else. It is always easy to draw conclusions without knowing the behind-the-scenes…
t6, S6, Elementum Terra, Ambit 3 Sapphire, Spartan Ultra Copper, Traverse Alpha, S7 Graphite LE, S9B Ambassador, S9P Granite Blue Titanium, S9PP Titanium Sand, Vertical All Black, Race Titanium Charcoal, Race S All Black / Titanium Courtney, Run Lime
-
@v-sacre said in Reviews:
@Tieutieu Based on DC table about features contained for both models, Vertical won’t have:
- running estimate and HR run threshold
- sleep stages and naps
But I really don’t know on what assumption DC made this table…
Except a “marketing” decision, I also don’t know what hardware limitation would avoid to have this on the SV.
Except a licensing limitation. Or something else. It is always easy to draw conclusions without knowing the behind-the-scenes…
Of course, you’re right. Let’s say it’s my « hopes » !
-
@Egika Correct, it’s all just speculation.
-
@v-sacre said in Reviews:
@Tieutieu Based on DC table about features contained for both models, Vertical won’t have:
- running estimate and HR run threshold
- sleep stages and naps
But I really don’t know on what assumption DC made this table…
Except a “marketing” decision, I also don’t know what hardware limitation would avoid to have this on the SV.
Except a licensing limitation. Or something else. It is always easy to draw conclusions without knowing the behind-the-scenes…
Yes, it is not necessarily the marketing‘s „fault“. But licensing? On the most expensive model? When they move away from FirstBeat algorithms? When the SV and the SR are part of the same technical platform? Don‘t get me wrong, it is good that you pointed out that „we don‘t know“, but it looks like an odd and arbitrary decision to me.
-
@Mauerwegler said in Reviews:
Don‘t get me wrong, it is good that you pointed out that „we don‘t know“, but it looks like an odd and arbitrary decision to me.
Be assured that there are no arbitrary decisions in this respect. Since delivering whatever solution will be chosen, needs programming and testing, a unified solution would be preferred from this perspective.
So to deviate from that, requires substantial reasoning. -
Let me help on some decisions .
- Previously Vo2max was calculated via FirstBeat license. Thats no longer the case already with Race. Its Suunto own algo.
- As you already know Race has some new features such as Race estimations and sleep stages. Those come from some licenses with other providers.
- Suunto atm is at the stage that is developing / evaluating all in house (or at least wants to).
So, its a matter of internal (and external fieldtesting, public surveys) evaluation. So to give an example:
- Suunto has developed Running marathon estimations. They work well. They benchmark those against FB , GoMore and other providers. If the result is good they will flip the switch to their own. Thats a no brainer. But when they want to release a model with those features, ie the Race , on launch they can go with whatever provider works better and pay the price to them (per unit usually).
You as users / consumers should keep in mind that Suunto is trying to provide a good solution to increase the consumer satisfaction based on factors such as launch timing, license expiration etc.
To be specific on the following update for the Vertical for example, the resources will be own algo. Same most probably is for running stats estimations (marathon time etc). That means that Suunto will have 2 different algos out there (2 watches with different algos ) and at some point 1 of the 2 algos will align to the best result.
To be honest the running time estimations (marathon etc) work better for me on the tests with SV with the Suunto in house algos than to what Race is using. That doesn’t mean it works better for all.
Bottomline, things will get aligned , but needs time.
-
-
A review from Quantified Scientist…not a very good one from the OHR and sleep tracking point of view
Samsung Galaxy S24
Suunto Race Titanium -
@JANTIKAINEN well, at least it didn’t crash
Edit: but I think this is not a surprise, the majority knows about their weaknesses. I personally can’t complain.
-
@JANTIKAINEN That’s exactly what I experienced with my Race. Excellent GPS tracking, but the OHR is a joke. I bought it even though I knew that. I just wanted to get rid of my Fenix 7 Pro.
I compared the watches for about 10 days. Activity tracking (elevation, distance) was more or less spot on. Night HRV and resting HR were also quite similar, but the sleep phases were completely different. The start and end of sleep were usually close, though.
Battery life on the Race is much better. The terrible OHR performance even made me start using a chest strap for my daily commute to work.
-
HR is a know weakness. But sleep stages from what I understand are incredibly hard to detect. Essentially all watches are off. I think DCrainmaker has some good discussion on it (I forget but I think he talked about in the context of his Apple Watch reviews at some point). I think any review of sleep stages in fitness watches should be taken with a huge grain of salt. The fact that the guy doesn’t even acknowledge the limitations of sleep tracking in general is somewhat problematic especially he is considering him as a “scientist”
