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    Suunto ZoneSense

    Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved SuuntoPlus™ Sports Apps
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    • mlakisM Offline
      mlakis Bronze Member @Brad_Olwin
      last edited by

      @Brad_Olwin, no graphs yet.

      I want a graph of ZS/HR and an explanation of how ZS helped you better than HR to pace your effort, in respect also to how many times the ZS was showing nonsense and instead of helping you it was misleading you.

      That’s what we are examining, what metric helps you better to pace you efforts.

      So, graph please.

      Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • herlasH Offline
        herlas Silver Members @Josaiplu
        last edited by herlas

        @Josaiplu your activities shown are not apple to apples right, in one you’re doing high intensity short periods vs the other it’s more sustained. Either way, I agree, if belt has issues it’ll throw off ZoneSense and if it’s that bad, even HR graph. you might need to replace your belt or sensor if this is happening frecuently, depending what your specific situation is and when completely sure that’s needed 👍.

        ZS dropping to green after a quick change in effort, like increasing pace for an interval start is known and it’s expected AFAIK.

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        JosaipluJ 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • stromdiddilyS Offline
          stromdiddily Gold Members @mlakis
          last edited by stromdiddily

          @mlakis said in Suunto ZoneSense:

          @stromdiddily graph please

          I don’t understand your graphs requirement to validate pacing guidance DURING the effort. Post workout, my ZS aerobic hr was 135. That’s ten beats lower than my entered zone 2 primarily because it was hot as heck and I was at elevation.

          If I would have followed the heart rate zone, more than likely I’m blowing up because I’m working way harder on that specific day than I was when I set my zones originally.

          It was a 26.5 hour activity. My graph isn’t going to help you.

          Always carry a flaggon of whiskey for snakebite; and furthermore, always carry a small snake.

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          mlakisM Brad_OlwinB 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 1
          • JosaipluJ Offline
            Josaiplu Bronze Member @herlas
            last edited by

            @herlas yes and I did not post to complain I like the feature a lot and use it most of the time my point was just for people that complain maybe looking into their data could explain strange behiavior 🙂

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
            • mlakisM Offline
              mlakis Bronze Member @stromdiddily
              last edited by

              @stromdiddily, since we are talking about data/metrics, graph IS the data/metric, which should be the same during and after the workout.

              If during a workout that is 1/2/5/24/72 hours ZS is showing nonsense in a large percentage of the duration in respect to when you could draw a useful conclusion, then it’s not useful.

              HR, Power and their zones are metrics that give you insight about your effort further than your perception, even before you exert yourself. They go beyond perception.

              A metric that shows me something meaningful 5% of the time that also agrees with my perception like when I can’t hit my usual numbers when it’s hot, if I am a bit ill, when I have overcooked myself the previous days or on the first hours of my activity etc, does not give me something useful, and also is misleading for the rest 95%.

              So, I insist for graphs and an explanation on how HR or Power that are drawn/shown can’t help you in a better way than ZS can.

              Brad_OlwinB EgikaE 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • ChrisAC Offline
                ChrisA Platinum Member @Brad_Olwin
                last edited by

                @Brad_Olwin I actually rarely looking on my HR Zones too now . I run with Zonesense and rely on it. IMO it’s great. I used to look on my HR zones and this was a constant distraction. With Zonesense I just run and when I feel, that I might have changed to another zone I check the display and see if that’s the case (and it often corresponds) and then I adjust my tempo correspondingly. For me I consider it kind of a game changer.

                Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 5
                • D Online
                  dulko79
                  last edited by

                  ZoneSense app has been updated on 10th October.

                  App: beta
                  Phone: Iphone
                  iOS

                  F 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                  • F Offline
                    far-blue Bronze Member @dulko79
                    last edited by

                    @dulko79 Anyone know if it will automatically update on the next watch SuuntoPlus sync? Or do you need to remove and re-add it?

                    Mff73M 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                    • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                      Brad_Olwin Moderator @mlakis
                      last edited by

                      @mlakis said in Suunto ZoneSense:

                      @Brad_Olwin, no graphs yet.

                      I want a graph of ZS/HR and an explanation of how ZS helped you better than HR to pace your effort, in respect also to how many times the ZS was showing nonsense and instead of helping you it was misleading you.

                      That’s what we are examining, what metric helps you better to pace you efforts.

                      So, graph please.

                      So, graphs are NOT helping me pace, looking at HR won’t matter because I do not gauge effort by HR. I keep trying to make this point ! I am solely basing effort on RPE when not using Zone Sense and now I am using ZS for pacing. My HR is irrelevant. I have now explained several times how ZS is helping me pace and I do not use HR so an HR graph will not help you to understand how I use ZS for managing my effort.

                      Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                        Brad_Olwin Moderator @ChrisA
                        last edited by

                        @ChrisA exactly the point I am trying to make! Thanks!

                        Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                        • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                          Brad_Olwin Moderator @stromdiddily
                          last edited by Brad_Olwin

                          @stromdiddily said in Suunto ZoneSense:

                          @mlakis said in Suunto ZoneSense:

                          @stromdiddily graph please

                          I don’t understand your graphs requirement to validate pacing guidance DURING the effort. Post workout, my ZS aerobic hr was 135. That’s ten beats lower than my entered zone 2 primarily because it was hot as heck and I was at elevation.

                          If I would have followed the heart rate zone, more than likely I’m blowing up because I’m working way harder on that specific day than I was when I set my zones originally.

                          It was a 26.5 hour activity. My graph isn’t going to help you.

                          Thanks! This is exactly my point. Others here are trying to force a relationship where one does not exist. There are a lot of data demonstrating why HR, Pace and Power are poor determinants to use while assessing trail running effort especially during ultras!

                          Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                          • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                            Brad_Olwin Moderator @mlakis
                            last edited by

                            @mlakis These perceptions are incorrect! For trail running and ultras pace, power and HR are either poor measures of effort or absolutely unhelpful. For example, after 6h, 15h or 20h of an ultra HR is useless as you are dramatically increasing fatigue! Power is useless as sand,. Roots and rocks are not assessed by power, neither is the cost of eccentric contractions running downhill. Similarly, pace is useless as well. That is why most trail and ultra runners use RPE. Now we have ZS and I think a game changer as I can prevent myself from going too fast at the beginning and too hard uphill.

                            Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 7
                            • Brad_OlwinB Offline
                              Brad_Olwin Moderator @Josaiplu
                              last edited by Brad_Olwin

                              @Josaiplu I am using a Suunto smart sensor belt. it is comfortable as the sensor is small.

                              Vector/T6c/Ambit 3 Peak/S5 Copper/S3/S7 Ti/S9 baro Ti/S9P Ti/S9PP Ti/Vertical Ti/Race Ti/RaceS/Ocean/Wing

                              mlakisM 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                              • mlakisM Offline
                                mlakis Bronze Member @Brad_Olwin
                                last edited by mlakis

                                @Brad_Olwin, I am talking about cycling power using a power meter which is spot on, not running power which is a poor derived estimated metric by the watches.

                                So, we have arrived to the conclusion that ZS is useful for trail running efforts equal on over 6 hours.

                                That’s a progression to initial statements of where ZS is useful/meaningful.

                                Thanks.

                                Brad_OlwinB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • Stefan KerstingS Offline
                                  Stefan Kersting
                                  last edited by

                                  @Brad_Olwin it’s maybe a little bit too early but did you test zs when backcountry skiing? Looking forward to do it because especially on the way up it could help me to adjust my effort

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                                  • Mff73M Offline
                                    Mff73 @far-blue
                                    last edited by

                                    @far-blue said in Suunto ZoneSense:

                                    @dulko79 Anyone know if it will automatically update on the next watch SuuntoPlus sync? Or do you need to remove and re-add it?

                                    https://forum.suunto.com/post/155821

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                                    • D Online
                                      dulko79 @Mff73
                                      last edited by

                                      @Mff73 Thanks for the link. I missed the original explanation post. 😉

                                      App: beta
                                      Phone: Iphone
                                      iOS

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • EgikaE Offline
                                        Egika Platinum Member @mlakis
                                        last edited by

                                        @mlakis here’s a lot of graphs with explanation:
                                        https://www.suunto.com/sports/News-Articles-container-page/introducing-zonesense-revolutionizing-intensity-insights-with-heart-stress-measurement/

                                        And you might watch the lecture that has a nice marathon example with graph: https://youtu.be/bD3O4BZ9vIc?si=KkS3NTd2Lp7eS1Qt

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                                        • VoiGASV Offline
                                          VoiGAS Silver Members
                                          last edited by VoiGAS

                                          For me Zonesense doesn’t work at all. Had the third run today with first warmup, then about 30 minutes all out, then pushing up a hill until maximum Heartrate - then cooldown.
                                          1000023378.jpg
                                          HR Zones where about 50% red in this run
                                          I can’t see how this values can be of any use


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                                          GhostG Brad_OlwinB M 3 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • GhostG Offline
                                            Ghost @VoiGAS
                                            last edited by

                                            @VoiGAS what is your setup? (Vertical + Suunto belt here and work surprisingly well)

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                                            VoiGASV 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
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