Suunto ZoneSense

[far-blue]

@VoiGAS Nothing wrong with sticking with an approach that works for you I’d suggest 2 ways ZoneSense could still benefit you even if you don’t use it as a primary metric.

1. It can help you set your HR zones more accurately. If you check the ZoneSense suggestion a few times to get a general idea of when it suggests your zone2->3 and zone 4->5 transitions should be you can adjust to match and you will have your LT1 and LT2 points aligned with the HR you are used to training with (accepting that recovery, illness, temperature etc. will mean these are not perfectly accurate).

2. On longer efforts or races (or long races!) stress and fatigue can change your LT1 and LT2 points significantly so keeping an eye on this using the S+ app by checking every half an hour or so can help you adjust the HR range you are aiming for. As an example, you might be running a HM an will start with an aim to be in the middle of zone 4 (“tempo” pace) but 60 mins in you notice ZS is showing you are dipping into ‘vo2max’ quite a lot so you could dial back to the top of zone 3 to make sure you aren’t overcooking things. Obviously the same applies if you are more focused on power. In the same way, if you know you can sustain a zone 5 pace for about 20mins and ZS has indicated you’ve mostly stayed out of ‘vo2max’ for your race so far you know you could prob. push the last 15mins up a gear.

[Ghost]

@VoiGAS ZoneSense is essentially a representation of RPE. Traditional metrics will always respond faster since heart rate, pace, or power react before fatigue fully sets in. No special context is needed. That said, you’re absolutely right — the best metrics are the ones that make you feel good, grounded, and in sync with yourself.

[VoiGAS]

@far-blue Good ideas, thank you!

[Brad_Olwin]

@VoiGAS This looks much better. You have some great comments from @Ghost and @far-blue. I think ZS is best suited for longer efforts and racing as stated. Using for intervals is tough, they need to be longer intervals.

[Mitch9]

Yesterday I had a race and the ZoneSense data (not realtime) is not representative (mostly aerob green but pushed really hard). I think it is because I didn’t record the warm-up and started the watch at race start.

Similar experience?

[Sergei Ladeishchikov]

Yes, the experience of using ZS at the beginning of the race is interesting

[Mitch9]

But some wrote here that they use ZoneSense in races. How is this possible? And I don’t want to start the activity before warm-up!!!

[Maryn]

@Mitch9 I think that the word “warmup” in the case of Zone Sense does not refer to a gentle run, it’s just that the algorithm needs 10 minutes of running (any kind of running, as long as it is continuous and not short intervals) to start working properly. Please correct me if I am wrong.

[Mattg576]

@Maryn

@Brad said above that “ZS needs a solid easy aerobic warm up of 10 min.”

I’m interested myself as I have some races coming up that I want to use ZS on but know they will
have a banzai start…

[Christoph13]

@Mattg576 I have a race coming up myself and will simply start by feel and pace as always and 30 minutes or so into the race start looking at the Zonesense page.

One thing I am still not clear about myself where in the yellow zone I would ideally want to be for a well-paced half marathon.

[The_77]

@Christoph13 on this I did a 1/2 test last year, with a ten minute warm up including some strides - so not from the gun but was almost all orange, and my last 10ish race was all orange, no red. Not that I really checked during the race since it was traily and knotty underfoot.

[Christoph13]

@The_77 Thanks for that but without knowing how far below the threshold between Z4 and Z5 you stayed it is impossible to know the answer to my question.
It is clear that one would want to run a half marathon in the yellow zone but the tricky bit is what you should strive for on the Zonesense data page in real time.

This is a race last year that I did and felt that it worked out well but a) I only looked at the Zonesense data after the race and b) could I have pushed a little harder still (while making sure to not overdo it) by drawing realtime feedback from Zonesense? That is basically my question.
https://forum.suunto.com/post/154967

[The_77]

@Christoph13 it is worth noting, now that I remember, that I was sick leading up to this - hence these HR zones:

I might be no further help, sorry!

[Brad_Olwin]

@The_77 said in Suunto ZoneSense:

@Christoph13 it is worth noting, now that I remember, that I was sick leading up to this - hence these HR zones:

I might be no further help, sorry!

The Z4/5 interface in this example is set too low. You should not be able to maintain Z5 for 30 minutes!

[Brad_Olwin]

@Maryn said in Suunto ZoneSense:

@Mitch9 I think that the word “warmup” in the case of Zone Sense does not refer to a gentle run, it’s just that the algorithm needs 10 minutes of running (any kind of running, as long as it is continuous and not short intervals) to start working properly. Please correct me if I am wrong.

I will check on this but I believe it needs an aerobic HR.

[Mitch9]

@Brad_Olwin This is the graph of the race:

[The_77]

@Brad_Olwin hence the caveat about being ill - I would never normally be able to do that.

[Brad_Olwin]

@The_77 Ill or not, Z5 can be sustained for minutes not half an hour. Your Z5 is too low, when ill you shouldn’t be able to reach Z5 at all.

[The_77]

@Brad_Olwin Suunto’s docs suggest setting threshold at the Z4/Z5 interval, which if I do based off average threshold length efforts, is usually 165/166 based off of prior races - and my average HR for this race of 40 mins was 167, which is basically that spot on. If I changed if by 2/3bpm to 167/168 it would entirely flip the percentage zoning.

[far-blue]

@The_77 maybe I’ve misunderstood what you wrote but it sounds to me like you are expecting ZS to align with the HR zones you set in your watch which are themselves based on generic ranges like 60% or 70% of HRR.

To be clear, your HR zones should be set based on ZS measurements, not the other way round, if you do still wish to use HR zones. ZS needs about 3 mins to stabilise after a pace change so may I suggest you try something like:

5 mins warmup
5 mins at what you consider threshold pace
2 mins recovery
5 mins at ~ 10s/km faster than the previous rep
2 mins recovery
5 mins at ~ 10s/km faster still
cooldown

hopefully that would push you just into vo2max and give you a first indication of where ZS thinks your LT2 point is. Doing a few more workouts at around that pace or HR will give you a general idea how to adjust your HR zones.

I know everyone is different but just to give you some idea, here’s my numbers.

resting HR (standing): 54
max HR: 187
Z2 -> Z3 (LT1 - where ZS goes green to yellow): 153
Z4 -> Z5 (LT2 - where ZS goes yellow to red): 172