Important news concerning our digital services

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in Important news concerning our digital services:

@Tobias-F said in Important news concerning our digital services:

@valdis830 said in Important news concerning our digital services:

I have iPhone 3, 4, 5 at home

your iphone are still working fine as standalone unit, with today’s announcement Suunto Ambit1/2, T3/4/6 Series, GPS trackpods are not longer working after 2020 because you need movecount.com mandatory to e.g. to add POD’s, adjust your bodymetrics, switch beween recording intervals or alter your sportmodes, so it’s a bit different here, Suunto is rendering these perfectly working devices obsolete by these lunatic change of the software platform without proper backwards compatibility

is that really the truth? Doesn’t your ambit work as a standalone as well and has many of these configs already in the watch available?

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos if movescount is stopped how to get out the activities from the watch? If the app itself continues to work, ok, but if it stops it is the end. Also I guess someone who sometime ago spent 500eur on a Ambit 2 sapphire won’t want to be that basic that couldn’t change settings. As someone said previously, this is business, but I guess Suunto forgot who were the people that prefered Suunto, people who valued products that last, that were stable and which can be trusted. Just hope that Suunto offers a solution for pre Ambit 3 watches, or do some partnership with openambit.

crawff

My Suunto Ambit 3 peak is a great watch that provides identical functionality to a spartan ultra - possibly better battery life than the spartan.

I purchased it before there was a mobile app - then went through the debacle that was the implementation of a terrible app that didn’t work or sync - for the next 12 months.

Have then dealt with a bunch of sync issues for large files that only third party open source people could fix.

Have then been pushed to this app two months ago despite it being in beta, for it to completely fail and then forced back to movescount because it wasn’t working.

Am now being told that i am being forced back to the suunto app.

Then this press release that gives zero relevant detail as to what is going to happen, and that people with perfectly good old watches will basically have to buy new ones (think of the environment for a second!)

This journey has been terrible! Why wouldn’t suunto just maintain functionality for all watches? and a desktop app.

Without a doubt, the minute my watch or those with Ambit 2 and below are not supported any longer by suunto i will never come back as a customer and will never recommend to anyone again. and will likely do my best to spread this news to the world where i can.

jsuarez

Pretty significant that there are a lot of users who have taken the time to register and post for the first time in this post… Most likely quite indicative of what they are feeling.

awinkel

@jsuarez
And I think that are mostly people who has any knowledge about software and understand what the impact is…
There are a lot of people which doesn’t know what the impact could be and would be pissed off at a later moment.
Suunto is making a very big failure now!
That only way they could people more or less a little bit happy is to announce very soon that the older watches would be supported in any way and that there still will be exist a website for a more detailled overview of the training.
Butt still many people would never buy a Suunto again after today.

jsuarez

@awinkel
That is why corporations need to give full insights to their customers.

If they had at least hinted what plans could materialise in 18 months time, it would have soothed many users. Even some of them would be happy.

But if you are announcing that you will be pulling the plug in 18 months and don’t give additional information, you could have waited 6 more and announced the actual full plans for the outage in 12 months.

In the end these watches are expected to have a long life. If nowadays people are keeping their phone 1 year more in average (which is hurting Samsung and Apple, for instance), why wouldn’t they make the same with their watches. Both the Ambits and the shiny Suunto 9 can provide the same functionality to many people.

@awinkel Do you seriously believe that Suunto people have no clue or sent this announcement just to trigger a few folks? Because I have a riddle for you in that case!

What do you make out of the fact that Apple Watch is spreading, Fitbit is bleeding, Polar seemingly abandoned its activity trackers, yet Garmin is charging obscene amounts of money for its Fenix line while entering traditional Suunto territory with Descent and Instinct? Why Suunto 3 Fitness all of a sudden, exclusive to Suunto app no less? What is in common between S3F and S9 from Suunto and Vantage series from Polar apart from a GPS chipset in some of these units? And if things are so dire for many traditional players, how come Amazfit and COROS of the world are storming into the market?

I feel there’s a method behind all of the madness of recent announcements, but we may not see things play out completely exactly tomorrow.

sartoric

Honestly … after a long , almost never ending reading, I understand the disappointment but I don’t understand the complaints or those lapidary sentences like “I won’t buy Suunto again”, “I’ll sold all my and my relative’s watches”, “it’s planned obsolescence” “I’ll dump in the trash all those Suunto stickers”.

Isn’t this a bit “overreacting” to a long term plan ?
I’ve never seen so many post in a day … well, in the last whole year

P.S.
I’m not a Suunto employee

DmitryKo

Well, the good news is we’ve got the answers to the questions regarding MovesCount / Suunto App integration roadmap.
The bad news, service cancellation is not exactly a roadmap.

If I were to oversee such a transition, I would at least try to convert as many existing users as possible to the Suunto App, setting up a cloud redirector service for devices lacking Bluetooth support ( M/T/X series, Quest, Ambit/Ambit2 sport watches; GPS Track Pod; and Dxi/DX, Cobra, Helo, Vyper, Zoop series dive computers).

To that end, I would implement the following:

make sure that full backup of MovesCount data is kept offline, that all user data can be scheduled for export and download on request, in well-documented industry-standard formats (not just .FIT .GPX), and that a compatible subset of this data could be transferred to Suunto App;
set up a web redirector service for the older Moveslink/Moveslink2/Suuntolink, so that

workout data and settings from non-Bluetooth LE devices could be transferred to the web service using Suunto App user credentials, and
satellite almanac on GPS-enabled devices could be updated from the web;

update SuuntoLink (or the Suunto App) to support USB charging cable MovesLink2 and DM5 protocols;
update SuuntoAppLink (or the Suunto App) to support wireless MovesLink for MoveStick Mini (ANT+/Suunto ANT) protocol;
extend the Suunto App to support user interface customization and personal settings of the above devices;
either make Moveslink/Moveslink2/Suuntolink connect wuth the Suunto App trough the above redirector web service, or update the Suunto App to directly support ANT+ and USB cable connections to old watches.

That said, I have absolutely no trust in Amer Sports to announce any measure similar to the above, save to fully implement it.

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in Important news concerning our digital services:

These Suunto products will not be compatible with Suunto app due to no mobile connectivity (Bluetooth).

Ambit, Ambit2, M-series, T-series and Quest Collection watches

Other dive computers connecting to Movescount via DM5

Suunto dive computers including D4i, D4i novo, D6i, D6i Novo, D9i, DX, Zoop, Zoop Novo, Vyper, Vyper Novo, Helo2, Vyper2 and Cobra2 will not be compatible with Suunto app due to no mobile connectivity (Bluetooth).

The data transfer does not include:

Personal information including body metrics

Routes

POIs

Suunto Movies

Groups you belong to

Events that you are attending

Training programs

Suunto Apps for your watch created by the Movescount community

Device settings

Your personal information including gender, age, weight and max HR, as well as routes stored on your Suunto watch will be synchronized to Suunto app once you connect your watch with the app. Please note that Suunto app does not display POIs as separate feature or as part of a route.

DmitryKo

One more thing. I wouldn’t count on Amer Sports to transfer Movescount.com web interface functionality and data models to SportsTracker.com - I’ve been their customer for 7 years and they never overdeliver on the promises. Thus I see no point in starting feedback threads, voting the polls, or filing support tickets. Believe me, this matter is closed.

I find highly disturbing the planned obsolescence for all Suunto watches released before 2015, only five years before the scheduled 2020 shutdown. They will be essentially bricked on the next day. There will be no means to unload your moves, change advanced settings, or upload the current almanac for GPS-enabled devices.

One may wonder if the management even knows how tight Suunto watches are integrated with MovesCount. I am pretty sure they do. It’s just Ambit3/Traverse and Spartan/9/3 models would encompass the majority of active MovesCount and Suunto App users by that time. For the rest of the customer base, Suunto will be super ‘excited’ to sell them brand new working watches.

So, please accept that fact and move on. Just business, nothing personal. One billion of new Chinese customers are waiting in the line.

Mike Green

@sartoric Many people, me and a few Suunto-owning friends included, consider Suunto to be a premium producer of sports watches. What that means to us is that the hardware and firmware are very considerably better than the competition in terms of longevity, stability and reliability, and this all adds up to ‘a quality product’, one which we can rely on in scenarios where reliability is genuinely important. A necessary part of that ‘high quality’ attribute, however is a comprehensive software interface, ideally across multiple platforms but one which, crucially, includes a web and/or desktop application for maximum ease of use and flexibility. At the moment, Movescount provides that.

In that context, even the newest, Bluetooth enabled devices will not be seen as ‘high quality’ by a significant proportion of potential purchasers simply because ‘high quality’, in the context of mapping and data analysis, is synonymous with web / desktop applications, not with phone apps, no matter how capable and stable those apps may be.

That’s one reason for the angry or dismayed responses, and it’s why plenty of people may choose not to use Suunto devices if there is no non-phone-app interface available. Clearly, there are also those who are, not surprisingly, less than happy at a perfectly functional device being ‘bricked’ too.

So, no, it’s not over-reacting since, for me at least, if Suunto moves to a phone app only scenario I have no other ‘high quality’ option to turn to to meet my requirements, and I know there are plenty of people who’d think in a similar way.

sartoric

@Mike-Green said in Important news concerning our digital services:

So, no, it’s not over-reacting since, for me at least, if Suunto moves to a phone app only scenario

This is the point “IF” … we don’t know now, so that’s why for me this is “overreacting”.
By the way, I prefer to use a web interface, me too

@Zdeněk-Hruška said in Important news concerning our digital services:

seems to me that everybody complains about things which are not even real issues

no real issues?
can you do customisation in SA for Ambits3 and Traverse after moveacount. com shut down? - NO

can you access your Ambit1/2/t3/t4/t6 Quest after summer 2020 for uploading moves/customize sportscreens or alter settings after movescount.com shut down? - NO

can you review your moves and exercise se data from any web enabled device or platform in a simple browser window after movecount. com shut down
NO

so you really think this is not an issue?

sartoric

@Tobias-F said in Important news concerning our digital services:

NO - NO - NO

How do you know ?
I mean, today

@sartoric because this what they said today in this announcement if you read it through the details and I doubt they are planning a spoet customisation for Ambit3/traverse in the Suunto App otherwise they would have said so…

ColdBeer

@sartoric said in Important news concerning our digital services:

@Mike-Green said in Important news concerning our digital services:

So, no, it’s not over-reacting since, for me at least, if Suunto moves to a phone app only scenario

This is the point “IF” … we don’t know now, so that’s why for me this is “overreacting”.
By the way, I prefer to use a web interface, me too

Please, colleague, stop to bluff… If Suunto had wanted to let us quiet and calmed, they had today their great opportunity. But, it’s obvious for me, at this moment they’ve got no intention of developing a web platform or giving Ambit 2 a continuation way. Trying to paint with pretty colors a death doesn’t change it in any way.

Maybe, and it’s possible, we could make a change but in my family, olders use to say something like: once a can tries to bit you, it’s time to look for another one. Obviously, it’s a sentence from other ages, but IMHO totally applicable here.

There were no"IF" in the Súunto release published yesterday, there were no promises too, and I couldn’t find any kind of project or alternative… Just Súunto App (IMHO, just a SportsTracker made-up and renamed) which is, at the end, just a very basic tool to upload your workouts and giving others (via API) a new connection to could sell customers just what Suunto doesn’t gives.

So, please, let’s start calling things by their real name.

@ColdBeer said in Important news concerning our digital services:

" calling things by their real name"

exactly! some companies will learn it on the hard way what it means to go from an open device independent feature rich web platform to a closed 10year sporttracker app spin off without backwards compatibility, for a company that is dependent on hardware sales like Suunto as their revenue stream will hurt to see thier customer go away based on this ‘software transition mess’

gest83

@roger821 … and the product descriptions for the zoop novo (see product page) still refers to be able to “share via movescount”, which is since yesterday definitely not a product feature anymore. Currently it’s only a missleading information/lie for a product which is still sold.

Shaun Hubbard

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos please give me links to the free services, which are as good or better than MC. or indeed any. Thanks S

awinkel

@NickK said in Important news concerning our digital services:

@awinkel Do you seriously believe that Suunto people have no clue or sent this announcement just to trigger a few folks? Because I have a riddle for you in that case!

I was replying to the comment of jsuarez who noticed that many users has registered after the announcement of Suunto yesterday.
The people who takes the effort for this has any knowledge what the impact will be.
There are a lot of customers too who read this but doesn’t know what the impact is.
Not everyone is familiar with hardware and software.
But they will be angry when their watch is useless after the migration to the app.

jsuarez

@Shaun-Hubbard
You may try runalyze.com . It is a great free service which according to their roadmap will rely on Suunto’s open API and will gain connectivity during 2019 Q1. Currently you would have to manually upload your .fit files, which you can still get from movescount.

Give it a try and let me know if you have any question.