New owner of Suunto Race - first feelings
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@Egika Its more a haphazard pattern than a rule.
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@Egika said in New owner of Suunto Race - first feelings:
yeah, if sound and vibration for structured intervals is a must, then maybe Suunto Race is not for you.<
True that! As already highlighted, all competitors have it but if Suunto does not want to hear, it can stay adamant about what it thinks its users need - just how it was adamant for a decade that its users do not need structure workouts. Makes you wonder why Suunto looses EUR 40m on EUR 50m sales. Love it - let’s keep this up and maybe another Chinese owner is already lining up at an ever deflating enterprise value.
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@geolerigolo I think Suunto simply has other priorities than interval training. Maybe this will change next year. I did a survey recently about training planning in the Suunto app. If this gets implemented, it would make a lot of sense to think about the implementation of structured intervals again.
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@wmichi Yes, but then what are their priorities? Names on the map would be a great start, as resolving the problem with turn by turn navigation, but I think they are losing a lot of sales because of the absence of alerts during workouts. That’s not just about interval training, if I want to do a long run in zones 1 and 2 I can’t right now, or I can but don’t get any alerts. The problem is that we don’t know what they prioritize and when it will be available. Garmin has now 4 firmware updates a year and it is clearly stated what will be introduced. And most of the time they really listen to their customer (except for the native integration of Stryd on the watch and that’s why I’m looking for a second watch to do my power workouts…). I get that Suunto has less money than Garmin but from what I have read they seem to prioritize things without having the basics first… It’s too unclear for me, I don’t know if and when I will get what with the new updates and that’s probably why I will switch to Polar if at least the alerts are not implemented on a soon to come firmware update. I won’t be waiting for too long even if I really like the watch itself and the app where I do recognize that they did a really good job. But as I said without the basics the watch is not what I’m looking for. And I don’t understand why the alerts are not a priority for Suunto, as well as making some Suunto app native to the watch and with the possibility to choose each parameter (e.g. slope, NPG, etc.) separately
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@geolerigolo said in New owner of Suunto Race - first feelings:
Names on the map would be a great start, as resolving the problem with turn by turn navigation
I don’t agree. Names of the streets wouldn’t fix TBT navigation. I mostly use maps when hiking paths that have no names. Besides, there have been good suggestions in this forum on how to improve the current turn-by-turn alerts and arrows. I hope Suunto will listen to the voice of reason.
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@geolerigolo this is the ever lasting struggle of product management. Weigh effort of implementation to the value of features and market demands.
What are absolutely basics for you, might be not so much for another person and vice versa. Not all users are like you…
Then some peoples requirements are even contradicting each other…While Suunto as no other company I know publicly disclose their feature priority list, I am sure a lot of heads in Suunto are smoking daily with this task.
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@BrunoH Forgot a part there, I meant “as well as resolving the problem with TBT navigation”, sorry
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@Egika Yeah, I get that my needs may differ from other people’s needs and I don’t judge that, it’s a normal thing. But what I am aware of is that all other major sport watch companies have native alerts and I don’t think it would be really hard for Suunto to add that. And if other companies have that feature on their watch it is probably because a lot of people use it, at least from time to time. Also, I read most of the manual before deciding to buy the Race and it was suggested that the alerts were implemented on it (or at least that’s what I understood, hence my choice to buy the Race), which is not exactly true.
I know that a lot of people in the Suunto team are working hard to make the watch and the app a better, I’m just not sure why it is the only company that doesn’t have real native alerts -
@geolerigolo unless you are a legacy Suunto user, this is the sort of question that has been asked of Suunto on pretty much every aspect of the software for the last few years. My personal opinion but the request for these things is rather mundane but a lot of the people in the know on this forum keep dismissing other users like “this isn’t for you” rather than acknowledge that this is a gap and Suunto should do better to remain competitive. Hence this forum feels a bit like an echo chamber. I have voiced concerns in gaps that Suunto has relative to all competition and if all I get is dismissive responses, then why the hell should I care?
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@altcmd I used to have a Suunto 9 Peak but resold it because the watch was too sluggish.
I was looking for a watch that has native Stryd power because I want to use power zones for my training, and it is not possible natively with the Fenix 7x that I have, and chose the Race because I like the Suunto app and the Suunto screens while running but I didn’t think it was impossible to have alerts on the watch, otherwise I would have waited to buy the new Polar watch.
But yes I agree that there are two many things that the watch doesn’t do for me to keep it. I have seen the “this isn’t for you comments”, and yes there is a gap with other companies, even if Suunto has made some important and interesting changes. I think they are the company with the most potential, but until they do the necessary adjustments (and stop their “soon policy” to actually deliver what is missing) I will have to go with another brand, hoping that they will rise again to where they should be should they do what is necessary -
@altcmd That said, most of the members are really nice and friendly and it is sincerely a pleasure to talk with you guys (and girls if there are some)
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@geolerigolo sorry to hear but I am genuinely hoping for a turnaround for Suunto given I live 10 mins away from them and have seen them for a long time as an establishment that would be really sore to lose. But of course my patience has limits and if I don’t see what I would like then so be it. Maybe Polar it is for me too.
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@geolerigolo I think in recent years Suunto has marketed their watches more as outdoor adventure watches than as training watches. Does an outdoor adventure watch even need intervals? When hiking for three days, no. When doing ultras, no. And I would say that a lot of people (amateurs) don’t do intervals when training for ultras. I think that’s the reason why the structured intervals are half baked.
And generally speaking, Suunto is for sure doing market research. I think they want to be appealing for those adventurous ultra runners and alike, respectively people who want to be like this. Just look at the recent ads with “Some people choose to…”. And if their research is telling them, this market segment doesn’t need/want structured intervals with all the bells and whistles, they don’t implement it. Or they do it as it is currently implemented: half baked to tick a box. But I think this will change with the SR, since it is marketed as a performance/training watch.
And still I think the Vertical and Race are great watches (build quality, GNSS accuracy, battery, great displays, generally a very good UI on the watch, good color and font selection, good readability). And the Suunto App is very well designed (although lacking some long term analysis functions) and keeps getting better and better. That’s an area where Polar is lacking. Polar Flow has been the same since years. This app/website could be so much better…
In your situation I would return the Race and buy a Polar. And then wait and see with what Suunto comes up next year. Or keep the Race, buy Polar and decide next year, which watch you sell, based on future firmware development.
I am still debating with myself, If I should return the SR and go for the V3. My main problems are the half baked structured intervals. When I had Polar, this was the number 1 feature I used on a daily basis. And the second problem is, that I have a pronounced wrist bone and wearing the SR 24/7 is 50% of the time simply painful, because the watch presses against the bone.
As others have pointed out, everyone has different expectations about basic functions. There is simply no perfect watch that suits everyone. First world problems.
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Just a short update to inform you guys that I’m really impressed with the sleep and nap recognition of the Race. Dead accurate so far and the “Resource” management widget for the first time seems to actually match how I feel in different moments of the day.
In the photo a really short and light nap, that I was unsure the watch would have caught.
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@General_Witt I second that. Nap detection is spot on, resources are for me also “correct” for the first time, although they still get reset, whenever I put the watch off for longer than a couple of minutes.
Unfortunately sleep tracking during the night doesn’t work so good for me. According to the watch I am awake half of the nights, which is wrong (yes, my resting HR is set up correctly). If I would only sleep 4 hours four 7 days (like the SR tells me), I would feel dead. Lucky me: I feel good
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Nap detection is spot on, but it is however a double edged sword when you have to listen to how was someone’s day and such, it will give you away in the nap log.
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@wmichi I have the same wrist bone. I didn’t even feel it for the first couple days but when I took it off my wrist bone had a deep red imprint. I’m assuming wearing it more would lead to damage. It’s really unfortunate because I really like the look of the Race. I’m sending it back due to construction issues, but will see what Suunto brings out next. I really like their app.
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@wmichi I don’t deny the good sides of Suunto, be it the team, the app and the watch, but still I do think implementing true alerts would attract more people and more importantly they would stay with Suunto and not change because of half-baked intervals or other. Moreover in the case of the alerts it is a thing they could do once and implement on all of their watches going forward. One little effort and then it’s all good.
I’m sure they do some research to know what people want and they choose accordingly.
I totally agree, I don’t really like the Polar app, as well as the Garmin app. Suunto is clearly ahead in this department, and both of these apps and websites would benefit from a revamp because they could be at least more modern and less old style.That’s what I’m stuggling with, I think I will wait till the end of the year to see if there is the firmware update I’m looking and hoping for, and then choose accordingly. Because the V3 would be a choice by default to be able to do my power workouts, but I don’t really like the watch itself or the app, even if that’s not the most important thing to me. And it has an AMOLED screen so it will still be nice. I also don’t really like Polar’s standby time which are half less than Suunto’s (8 days for Polar vs 12+ for Suunto). As I said above, I really love the Race as a watch and prefer it to the V3.
If the watch is painful, I think the choice of reason would be to take another watch, be it a Suunto, or Polar or other that doesn’t hurt your wrist.
Couldn’t agree more with your last sentence…
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@geolerigolo I absolutely agree with you. The funny thing is, for Suunto Guides and Suunto Apps no firmware update should be needed to update them. So if a Suunto Guide can trigger vibration and make the watch beeping, it should be rather simple to add this feature. Of course I have no insight into Suunto Guide development. Hopefully one day every “adventurous” Suunto owner can play around with this
But I could bet, If Suunto added this, there would be other people complaining about those alarms. “Simple” fix: make it configurable in the watch or guide settings. And then others would complain, because there is another setting to make, and settings make watches complicated and oh my god my Suunto is like a Garmin feature creep watch from hell.
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@wmichi I don’t know if Suunto apps and guides have access to every watch settings, they seem to be separate pieces. Yes, honestly alerts are the major reason why I may switch company if it is not fixed soon.
I have a Garmin and I’m happy to have the choice to be able to select the alerts I want and to disable them if/when I don’t need them and on the go.
But you’re probably right, there are always people complaining about something just like we are doing right now lol
