New software update for S9P-S9B-S9-S5P-S5 and S3 devices 2.20.28

cosme.costa

With this FW version the calculation of the VO2max has been optimized for trail running, but in my case I think that is less reliable than before and it goes down very easily.

Till now I knew more or less how it will react regarding my pace, HR and run duration but with the new algorithm I hadn’t detect yet how it behaves. I have done two or three nice trail running, with nice ascent, quite nice pace and quite good HR and VO2Max keeps going down.

Not that I care much but I would like to know how it behaves.

freeheeler

@cosme-costa
not that I have much experience with VO2max behavior over time, but since I run more frequently VO2max went up. Since the new FW I felt I became better, but VO2max goes down for me, too

isazi

@cosme-costa I live in the flat, but with new firmware I am seeing VO2max going up with walking activities and small hills, while before it was only going down walking uphill. And I’ll probably not be able to test it on real mountains until June/July, but then we may already have another firmware, who knows

cosme.costa

@freeheeler The thing for me is that in flat runs (sportsmode in the watch: running) I more or less have the same behaviour than before, I haven’t seen much difference. But with the new algo when I do trail running (sportsmode in the watch: trail running) my VO2max goes down despite my numbers are better, and with the previous FW I’m pretty sure that VO2max would not have went down, at least I would have stayed stable.

cosme.costa

@isazi said in New software update for S9P-S9B-S9-S5P-S5 and S3 devices 2.20.28:

but then we may already have another firmware, who knows

You know

It is not a big deal, but I feel fitter, my times says the same, and my HR is more controlled than before (I have always had high HR in general comparing with other people) and my VOmax goes down more easily.

DMytro

@isazi just was out in the mountains yesterday, can confirm that my hike increased vO2max by 2 points. Regular flat hikes/walks don’t seem to impact the score though.

DMytro

@cosme-costa maybe it’s because your HR isn’t that high anymore? I feel like this algorithm is much more accurate while training in the last two zones.

Djordje S

@cosme-costa it started to increase with running and one walking activity decrease it for 0,5

Brad_Olwin

@cosme-costa @DMytro My VO2 Max has been going up as well compared to the prior firmware. Check your HR zones too.

DMytro

@brad_olwin even though mine is going up, it’s still at 31 XD. I most hike/walk, so for now vO2max hasn’t been a helpful metric, other than to remind myself that my fitness age is 74.

freeheeler

@dmytro
https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/finding-your-maximum-using-vo2-max-in-training/

in the watch VO2max is an estimation only… similar to burnt calories, right? even I started looking at my VO2max values a bit more recently, I still don’t trust it.
instead I started to check my avg HR and NGP for running activities…
…and when I go for mountain bike rides again, I don’t care, I just enjoy

DMytro

@freeheeler sure, I have no illusions here XD.
Just giving a feedback as a almost-no-running person. Maybe, it’ll be taken into account. I still don’t really understand, why walking/hiking is consider for vO2max estimates, since the result is so inaccurate. I could have understood it in a ‘power walking’ sport, but not in the regular one.

freeheeler

@dmytro said in New software update for S9P-S9B-S9-S5P-S5 and S3 devices 2.20.28:

I still don’t really understand, why walking/hiking is consider for vO2max estimates

me neither especially since I’ve read the short TP summary about VO2max…

cosme.costa

Thank you guys for the answers!

Probably I need to do a test lab again and redefine my HR zones. I did a test two to years ago and the V02max from the watch has been always quite similar, 1 or two points down max.

My doubts about the algorithm is because on Wednesday morning I did a trail running, not pushing, only pushed for 1 km (Strava segment ) and VO2max was more or less the the same than the day before (some tenths down) , at evening I did a hike and the VO2max kept the same value but yesterday I did, what I consider, a nicer trail run (same ascent, 30 seconds less per minute in pace and 7 bpm more in HR avg) and the VO2 went down by 0.7 points.

I guess is something related to the HR zones, but on the other hand I do not think my zones have changed that much in 1 month.

Mff73

@cosme-costa
Did you check the zones setup in your watch after the FW update ?
Could it be that after the update of your watch, the zones were changed/resetted to other values that your real ones ?

freeheeler

@mff73
I’ve checked mine and they remained the same after the updates

Mff73

@freeheeler
You, but maybe not @cosme-costa .
Just worth checking that this point is checked.
Last time I updated FW… I don’t remember with my SSU

cosme.costa

@mff73 I just have checked and like @freeheeler the zones are still the same.

If nothing changes, on Saturday and on Monday I want to do some trail runs with good ascent, will see how it behaves.

Thanks!!

freeheeler

@cosme-costa
side comment: I’ll propably do 1 or 2 runs in an area that I don’t know over the long weekend… I will rely on the navigation screen… it would be really nice to have the HR dial plus maybe 2 more values in the navi screen to avoid endless pressing of middle button, or living on the edge while running unlocked in order to swipe the screens…
#featurealreadysuggested

…a hotfix would be nice

cosme.costa

@freeheeler said in New software update for S9P-S9B-S9-S5P-S5 and S3 devices 2.20.28:

@cosme-costa
side comment: I’ll propably do 1 or 2 runs in an area that I don’t know over the long weekend… I will rely on the navigation screen… it would be really nice to have the HR dial plus maybe 2 more values in the navi screen to avoid endless pressing of middle button, or living on the edge while running unlocked in order to swipe the screens…
#featurealreadysuggested

…a hotfix would be nice

I agree with this suggestion but, because its has some buts, must be implemented very well. In my opinion the HR dial shouldn’t be a problem, but adding some fields must be implemented very well in order of not having problems with the navigation. I had a bike computer that has a similar navigation than the S9B and you are able to add two data fields in the screen navigation, the problem with it is that if you have consecutive close turns when the device is redrawing the route in the screen it gets covered by the datafields so at some point you don’t see well the route until you have some straight or more open route.

I use navigation quite often, and it is quite good as it is now, some things can be better, of course, but add features and do not touch what it is working properly right now.

BTW, I’ve said that would be good to have the HR ring in navigation screen but as I’ve written in other posts for me is not a big deal to have HR or not, I like to check the values afterwards but I nearly never train or race checking/limited by HR values.