Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing
-
Hi,
I am the developer of ErgSync and also on-and-off indoor rowing enthusiast for many years. I rented RowErg with PM5 for 3 months for home office to develop the SuuntoPlus app and also to accrue some rowing meters in the process. The plan is to add a Suunto watch as additional data recording option for rowing enthusiasts in addition to existing ErgData phone app (which I am also using for testing and comparing the results).
I mainly use Strava but Suunto platform also supports dozens of other sports and health platforms and services including their own built-in activity visualization and analysis features.
I am currently reviewing the initial feedback from you and will publish new version of ErgSync app soon. I already enabled logging for 4 main sensor readings from PM5 and updated ui to use icons in the dev version. I will keep you updated.
with best regards,
Martin -
@TonyG The HR connection to the PM5 is different from the FTMS (FiTness Machine Service) connection that gives rowing data. It’s the latter I believe can only be used by one thing. When people use the EXR app, for example, they can’t also use ErgData, but EXR can write to the C2 logbook.
If I’m wrong on this, then I’m happy to be corrected.
Some Garmin watches can get rowing data from the PM45 by ANT+ but not bluetooth as I understand.
-
@runomatic said in Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing:
@raven said in Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing:
As for the watch showing 620m vs 500m, if the watch is using the internal accelerometers for pace (rather than a connection to the PM5) then that would explain it. Suunto always overestimates. I just did a 6km row a bit ago and Suunto thought it was 6.88km. Note you can edit distance in the session record.
I thought one of the purposes of ErgSync was to ensure that the distance matches the ergometer. Otherwise, what’s the point of the app?
Note I’m just guessing on “why” the discrepancy. It is likely simply a bug of some kind, but a bug of “writing the acceloremeter data not the PM5 data” seemed to make more sense than “taking the PM5 data and changing it”.
For me, the point of this app would be getting power data, not distance. I treat rowing like cycling, doing power targets for time durations, and have rowing power zones I pay more attention to than pace, and likewise, cumulative kJ rather than meters.
-
Just tried app, i used a inder rowing as a sport and added app via suunto plus…is that the way to go?
Connected quickly and it was in sync with machine all the time -
Hi,
I just uploaded version 0.4 of ErgSync to SuuntoPlus store:
- 3 screens with all stats from PM5 (use bottom button to switch)
- added logging of 4 main stats
- switched to using icons
- fixed distance display (4 > 5 digits), please test
- display wrist HR
TODO
- update graphics and descriptions in SuuntoPlus store for new version
- improve the readability of data (restore text descriptions instead of icons - please give feedback)
- looking into options of how to send the activity along with 4 logged stats to Concept2 LogBook (ErgData)
-
said in Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing:
Hi,
I just uploaded version 0.4 of ErgSync to SuuntoPlus store:
- 3 screens with all stats from PM5 (use bottom button to switch)
- added logging of 4 main stats
- switched to using icons
- fixed distance display (4 > 5 digits), please test
TODO: update graphics in SuuntoPlus store for new look
Here are some photos of ErgSync v0.4 https://photos.app.goo.gl/LRGEyvKZCFhAu9oA7
-
@Martin-Lillepuu Tested the update, and it is fantastic,
connecting/ data stream is still rock solid and now that the main stats are visible in the graphs on the mobile app, the app is pretty complete (at least for me), I appreciate the work you have put into it!I will be testing how the app works when switching between different rowing machines at the rowing club.
Also, don’t know how the speed in the graph is logged in apps like Erglog but if it would be possible to show the speed/500m as the rowing machine shows it on the mobile app graph, as it currently looks like to be in seconds/500m.
-
In my case, I absolutely need a connection between the ErgData app and my smartphone to have my data in the C2 logbook. Therefore, there’s no way to connect the Suunto watch to the PM5. What I’m requesting is a connection between the C2 account and the Suunto account so that the data can be synchronized with the Suunto app after each race. Only then would the Suunto app be able to properly evaluate the rowing sessions.
-
I just tested it at 10k. It works well. It’s just a mirror of the PM5, though. Unfortunately, the values themselves aren’t transferred to Suunto. My 10k reading became 10.5k and had to be corrected before saving.
-
Gave it a shot on suunto vertical yesterday really pleased to get the actual power data pulled in with HR
The automatic detection/ connection to the PM5 is nice, but potentially not nice if you can’t confirm which unit you’re connecting to in a room with a dozen ergs being used at once.
-
It’s a bit of a crafty solution, but you could use an app like boatcoachapp with USB cable support to track and upload to the Concept2 logbook. But also hoping there will be a better option. And thanks for your developments!
-
Did some intervals the other day, and when in recovery between the intervals the last recorded power and stroke rate seems to be continuously logged until the next interval starts. Assuming this is a PM5 thing as its data also looks to be locked, but maybe the data is on a different data stream or those values can be set to zero for the Suunto logging during recovery time?
-
Oh yea, and another thing, when switching between PM5 workouts, the distance always reflects the last distance from the PM5,
Example, warm up row in “just row” shows distance for that, then switching to intervals, there is a new distance, then cool down row in “Just row” will be the last logged distance that then gets sent to the mobile app.
A solution could be to have a dedicated distance variable on the watch app that continuously adds the distances during the whole workout for later sending.
-
@peringmar I assume you’re not active during the rest portion of intervals? When I do interval workouts, during rest periods I continue to take light strokes at low power. Screenshot from intervals.icu
I consider a session as having continuous movement without stopping so if I were to do several 100m sprints and racking the handle in between, I’d record them as distinct sessions.
I’m similar with cycling and running. If I do intervals in cycling, I keep spinning during recoveries at low power, etc.
-
@raven
Think you miss interpreted what I wrote, so I hope this clarifies it.-
I too keep rowing at a slower pace in the rest sessions of intervals, but the issue that I posted was that when the rest session is activated when doing intervals on the PM5 (the interval mode) the last measured power and stroke rate keeps getting logged on the watch until the next interval starts. So no rest session power/stroke rate gets logged until the next interval starts.
-
A proposed solution for the distance was the following. Example:
10 minute warmup in “Just row” (2500m) gets written to variable “distance” on the watch.
Switch to intervals on PM5, the intervals (4000m), variable “distance” gets updated to 6500m
Exit intervals, cooldown in “Just row” (1000m)
final variable “distance” 75000m gets sent to mobile app, instead of just 1000m like its currently.
Suunto Spartan Sport WHR
Suunto Race -
-
said in Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing:
the last measured power and stroke rate keeps getting logged on the watch
From my screenshot, where the continues lines lie at like 440 Watts during the rest mode instead of the actual power
-
Good work, guy. But really, there’s no need for a connection like this. The PM5 needs to be connected to a smartphone to plan and upload races. What we need is a connection from C2 to Suunto to actually use the load values in CTL/ATL, etc.
-
@peringmar said in Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing:
@raven
Think you miss interpreted what I wrote, so I hope this clarifies it.-
I too keep rowing at a slower pace in the rest sessions of intervals, but the issue that I posted was that when the rest session is activated when doing intervals on the PM5 (the interval mode) the last measured power and stroke rate keeps getting logged on the watch until the next interval starts. So no rest session power/stroke rate gets logged until the next interval starts.
-
A proposed solution for the distance was the following. Example:
10 minute warmup in “Just row” (2500m) gets written to variable “distance” on the watch.
Switch to intervals on PM5, the intervals (4000m), variable “distance” gets updated to 6500m
Exit intervals, cooldown in “Just row” (1000m)
final variable “distance” 75000m gets sent to mobile app, instead of just 1000m like its currently.
Ah, thanks for clarifying. I’m rowing on a WaterRower/SmartRow combination, and while I’ve done quite a bit of Concept2 rowing, I never used their interval mode. On the PM5, can you program to go from one work intensity to a second work differing intensity without a “rest” interval?
-
-
@Sportsfreund said in Suunto and Concept 2 indoor rowing:
Good work, guy. But really, there’s no need for a connection like this. The PM5 needs to be connected to a smartphone to plan and upload races. What we need is a connection from C2 to Suunto to actually use the load values in CTL/ATL, etc.
A connection from the C2 logbook to import into Suunto seems not within the scope of what is possible with a SuuntoPlus app, but rather, that ability would need to come from a collaboration of Concept2/Suunto themselves. If Suunto wishes to do that, then perhaps they can also talk to SmartRow so sessions from the SR logbook could also auto-upload to Suunto? http://www.smartrow.fit/
This setup would be for people not currently using the PM5 bluetooth connection to send data elsewhere like ErgData or EXR, etc.
People on alternate rowers like the RP3 or the SmartRow system I use may one day benefit from the work here if it extends beyond the Concept2. I have two data connections from my power meter, so one can go to my SmartRow app and another could go to a connection like this. Perhaps eventually C2 will update the PM5 to allow dual bluetooth signals as many cycling power meters have.
